• It's time once again to ferret out those murderous vampires in a new VAU - Vampires Amongst Us. A cross between Cluedo and a roleplay, sometimes gory and often hilarious! Find out more and sign-up! here.

Dakaar

Zombie
Jan 14, 2013
49
Great post Najo, and i like the sound of that but theres still 2 things that are very possible and potentially total deal breakers for me

1) bubbles of reality in the warp. That is a horrible setting and nothing like the world picking itself up and reorganising like you describe above - a still intact physical world.

2)

Then look at the End Times models coming out. That is the face of the new Warhammer to come

See thats the direction i dont like, few big models (smaller model count armies along with it, going to more skirmish but still at the high points values, rather than the game i started and like - units of infantry and cavlry supported by missile troops and warmachines.

Yes I may still be able to do that, but ill be if the direction in end times is how they are going, ill be facing small model armies made of big monsters mostly.
 

Adam_Barrow

Sleepless Knight
True Blood
Dec 25, 2010
3,068
Nashville, TN
Other than the odd character clampack, I'm assuming 9th will be what the majority of ET releases have been. There's a reason there was no new Plague Monks box released with all this Skaven stuff.

I'm expecting $50-$100 kits, on big bases. No army books because rules will be in boxes. No regiments on 20mm anymore, unless they're ~10-20 models tops. And that's only a concession I'm making because of rumors that haven't come from the big 3 (Harry, Darnok, Arturius11), so I kinda doubt them as well.

I'm imagining a Warhammer where nothing smaller than a Crypt Horror is playable.
 

Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,714
i agree 8th is pretty good. On the other hand, i feel 7th ed 40k is an absolute mess, and in no way an improvement on 6th, which i didnt like more than 5th, and i wouldnt really choose over 4th if it were up to me, at least not in terms of core game rules. Yet 40k sells fine for gw while fantasy is apparently so stagnant as to need a total overhaul. As such i am actually quite worried by the possibility of gw deciding they should make fantasy's rules more like the 40k.

Not so much that im rage quitting, but it has certainly sucked out a lot of the enthusiasm for the game that end times had previously built up for me.
 

najo

Mortarch of the Dark Soul
True Blood
Dec 23, 2012
2,046
Oregon
i agree 8th is pretty good. On the other hand, i feel 7th ed 40k is an absolute mess, and in no way an improvement on 6th, which i didnt like more than 5th, and i wouldnt really choose over 4th if it were up to me, at least not in terms of core game rules. Yet 40k sells fine for gw while fantasy is apparently so stagnant as to need a total overhaul. As such i am actually quite worried by the possibility of gw deciding they should make fantasy's rules more like the 40k.

Not so much that im rage quitting, but it has certainly sucked out a lot of the enthusiasm for the game that end times had previously built up for me.
What specially do you not like about 40k 7th. Give me a bullet point list.

@Dakaar I don't think the bubbles of reality are going to happen so much as things both myself and @Infernal Skull have been saying that we are going to see planar rifts that connect the Old World more directly with the Eye of Terror/Realm of Chaos. That would give us a big playground and a more varied palette in battle scenarios, terrain options, etc. I could be wrong, but reality bubbles hasn't had a positive response yet and part of Warhammer Fantasy's appeal is its grimdark fantasy setting. Why go through all the trouble of the end times and building on to Warhammer Fantasy just to throw it out the window? The reality bubble rumor is either a) a misundertood rumor connected to the Slaan or b) a poor description of the after world effects when the Chaos Gates collapse.

@Adam_Barrow I really doubt we are going to lose the basic infantry models. Yes the game will focus on some of that, but I think we will have options to build either types of armies and play them against each other. Just last week, I had a 1500 pt game where I played Mortarch Mannfred, 3 Morghasts, 30 ghouls, 2 units of dire wolves, and a baby vamp. It was against Orcs & Goblins, which he had 3 warmachines, a block of 40 night goblins with fanatics, a horde of 40 black orcs, a level 4 shaman, a black orc boss and 2 units of goblin wolf riders.

I was purposely playing with fewer and larger models to see what it would be like. Anyrate, it still felt like warhammer. I had a good time and my army had lots of neat tricks in it. The game played fast too. I think the future of Warhammer is going to be variety of point values, scenarios and army builds. That is going to be good for the game as it will represent many styles of conflicts instead of only massive armies meeting in battlelines.
 
Last edited:

MushroomLord

Zombie
Dec 26, 2014
31
Philadelphia
The rumors are brutal imho, simply because I just started collecting fantasy again. I have a list built that I want to build, but by the time I get the models and get it all built, painted, and ready to go, I now have to worry about them not even being useable?
 

najo

Mortarch of the Dark Soul
True Blood
Dec 23, 2012
2,046
Oregon
The rumors are brutal imho, simply because I just started collecting fantasy again. I have a list built that I want to build, but by the time I get the models and get it all built, painted, and ready to go, I now have to worry about them not even being useable?
Rumors have stated that all current armies and the end times lists will be compatible. Our army is likely safe to, considering it's the most popular and best selling of the armies.
 

Blutsauger

Vampire Count
Apr 10, 2013
1,089
Najo, I like your optimism but I don't share it. What I like about WHFB is that it is a generic fantasy world, where I can carve my own little empire if I want, or hitch my wagon to some already established background.

Changing that world fundamentally, changes my motivation to carve out my own empire. As an old Bretonnian player, I would have zero interest in re-starting a Bretonnian army that is simply a facet of the Empire army. Likewise I would have zero interest in starting a Dwarf army that is an add-on of the Empire army, especially if Sigmar or Karl Franz became a 'good' Chaos power and became the go-to power-house units to combat Chaos. My motivation to play a Vampire army only comes from the fact that I go through considerable mental acrobatics to maintain my own vision of Sylvania and the Old World in general.

What I want to see from 9th is the current setting +200 years, where all the old factions return to their old haunts and rebuild their old empires, maintaining the generic feeling of the world. I want them to reset the clock without fundamentally changing the way the armies work or feel, and without changing my ability to create my own little kingdom.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Wolf Child

Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,714
What specially do you not like about 40k 7th. Give me a bullet point list.

We already played this game, Najo. To recap, it was: the movement rules, the flier rules, the super-heavy rules, the challenge rules, the wound allocation rules, the scenario rules (particularly the card-based ones - I like the idea of secret random scenario objectives, but hate the execution), the random terrain and objective rules (also a problem in fantasy already, but still), the army selection rules (both messy and confusing, you don't know how many arguments I've had to go through trying to explain to people that the 'core' units in their formations don't have objective secured unless the formation specifically says so, and even when people aren't getting confused over the rules they still spread out a single faction's stats and rules over half a dozen sources which is just obnoxious at the game table), the ally rules (which compound the messy, confusing army selection rules by adding another half-dozen sources for every extra faction). That on top of the rather inconsistent faction design, though that has been slightly better for the last few books, but nothing like as consistent as 8th was overall, and given 40k's history I don't at all expect them to get through 7th without some major swing in faction design philosophy.
 
Last edited:
Nov 13, 2013
927
Vancouver, Canada
Najo, I like your optimism but I don't share it. What I like about WHFB is that it is a generic fantasy world, where I can carve my own little empire if I want, or hitch my wagon to some already established background.

But you CAN'T just "carve out your own little empire" at the moment, because the fluff is so fixed and stagnant and there really isn't any room for expansion. The borders are defined, and if you want to change them you must rewrite the fluff.

...which is of course an option, but it's an option whatever direction things go with 9th. You can write your own world. Play WHFB in the old one world or the new.

Changing that world fundamentally, changes my motivation to carve out my own empire. As an old Bretonnian player, I would have zero interest in re-starting a Bretonnian army that is simply a facet of the Empire army. Likewise I would have zero interest in starting a Dwarf army that is an add-on of the Empire army, especially if Sigmar or Karl Franz became a 'good' Chaos power and became the go-to power-house units to combat Chaos. My motivation to play a Vampire army only comes from the fact that I go through considerable mental acrobatics to maintain my own vision of Sylvania and the Old World in general.

I anticipate that Sylvannia will be shorn off as one giant chunk, protected by the will of Nagash. It's been strongly foreshadowed in the fluff, as **SPOILERS** Nagash bound the essence of the wind of Death to the land of Sylvannia itself.

What I want to see from 9th is the current setting +200 years, where all the old factions return to their old haunts and rebuild their old empires, maintaining the generic feeling of the world. I want them to reset the clock without fundamentally changing the way the armies work or feel, and without changing my ability to create my own little kingdom.

Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooring.

The Warhammer world is boring, bland, and generic. It's been exactly the same for thirty years. The same damned characters fighting the same damned battles, with Chaos always on the brink of destroying everything but never getting further than Middenheim without a retcon or orc headbutt pushing them back.

"Building your own narrative" has ALWAYS been core to the philosophy of GW's games. However WHFB is hamstrung by their stagnant world with its defined borders and lack of mystery. Bretonnia can only expand by conquering parts of the Empire or Tilea/Estonia. You need to go through mental gymnastics to justify why Tomb Kings and Lizardmen are fighting a campaign against each other, and on that medieval city board nonetheless.

When GW progresses the storyline I will 100% guarantee you that it's to appeal to exactly your type of player. The sort of person who wants to make their own mark on the world, and forge their own narratives. They'll just come up with a reason why any army could be fighting any other army on any terrain type...just like they do in WH40K.


EXAMPLE: The Empire cities of Hochmarch and New Middenheim were founded on a large planar shard, comprised of rolling fields and a few ore-rich mountains, shortly after the Sundering. Some time after then a flotilla of dwarven airships carrying refugees arrived. Some of the refugees left the flotilla and established a hold in the mountains, and began mining their ore and trading with the surface folks. The rest of the flotilla cast off, its denizens feeling more at home in the sky now than they ever did underground.

Some 200 years pass, and Hochmarch and New Middenheim grow into sprawling metropolises, that strain the resources of this tiny shard of land. The dwarfs have all but exhausted the once-rich veins of ore beneath their holds.

Just when things look most dire, a deadly warp storm rocks the plane. When the people come out of their shelters they find that their plane has collided with another, more than doubling in size.

An armed expedition is hastily arranged. The people of Hochmarch and New Middenheim send armed riders, while the dwarfs of the mountain holds send their best rangers. They venture out together into this newfound land, hoping that it will contain the resources their people so desperately need to survive.

And it does. The rivers are flush with spawning fish, the forests with great trees, the mountains rich with ore....and also swarming with orcs. They pour out of their warrens like an endless plague, and the men and dwarfs find themselves in the fight of their life. They've not known war in 200 years, but now must battle for their very survival.

Making matters worse they are not the only plan that collided with this one. A shard of Lothlorien has also found itself fused with this plague of orcs. But they have been lost deep within the eye of Chaos, fighting against an endless incursion of demons. Their society is a steel blade honed for war, and they have no use for the soft humans and dwarfs who have known only peace. The resources of this new land are theirs for the taking, and they will hear no objections from the envoys of the dwarfs and men.



The campaign is on! Arrange your Mighty Empires tiles to represent this new land. Refer to the campaign book to see what plunder your people get from victory as you push into new territory, discovering ancient ruins or seizing a weapons cache from the enemy.
 

Dakaar

Zombie
Jan 14, 2013
49
The Warhammer world is boring, bland, and generic. It's been exactly the same for thirty years. The same damned characters fighting the same damned battles, with Chaos always on the brink of destroying everything but never getting further than Middenheim without a retcon or orc headbutt pushing them back.

Historical wargaming has been going on for longer than warhammer fantasy and its settings have always been the same, no one seems to mind.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Yorga
Nov 13, 2013
927
Vancouver, Canada
Historical wargaming has been going on for longer than warhammer fantasy and its settings have always been the same, no one seems to mind.

Historical wargaming is a very different beast. People are reenacting historical campaigns and battles. It's in essence a simulation.

Games like WHFB are more about forging your *own* narrative. Sure there are people interested in re-enacting "historical" battles (a la the games in the End Times campaign). However a great many more people like the "role playing" element of playing in a big open world where their actions can change leave their mark on the world.

A WHFB world where the borders are less "defined" would facilitate that, without detrimenting the people who already like re-writing a setting to reflect their own narratives. You can just retcon the Sundering to never happen, if you're so inclined. If you're not inclined, and like playing in a setting as-is, then the WHFB world isn't really amenable to crafting narratives.



My initial hope was that the face of the WHFB world would be irreparably changed. The factions would all be crushed, the borders of the world all but erased, and 9th edition would begin in a world with much more "fog" separating known factions...giving us some room to craft our own narratives in. A crusade to regain the lost territory of the Empire or Bretonnia. Orcs flooding into the gaps to create an Empire of their own. The forces of Nehekhara and Lustria forced out of the comfort of their ancient abodes, if only temporarily or in search of some goal.


But this new setting has the potential to do this much more effectively. A world that isn't 2-dimensional and linear creates much more space for inserting your own narrative, just like WH40K does. You can create a 40K planet for a campaign, fabricate a justification for all of your friends' armies to be there, and allow it to be destroyed without fundamentally altering the WH40K world. Every advance in the setting doesn't "erase" the narratives you've crafted together. As far as the setting is concerned it could as well be canon.

A setting full of fragmented demi-planes does the same thing. Give yourself ways to connect them, be it portals or inter-planar transports (i.e. dwarven airships), and you're golden. Add in "warp storms" a la 40K to explain why some portions of the universe aren't reachable. A new plane can pop up, with a slight variant on existing factions being reunited with the rest and bringing some unique technological or strategic asset with them (i.e. new units, tactics, etc.).

It's a brilliant way to inject new content into the world, while still making it more flexible for narrative gamers. I think people need to give it a chance and see what GW comes up with when it comes out.

I mean...we can all agree that the ET books have been fantastic, right? Why expect that they'll skate right up to the 1-yard line and drop the ball before scoring a basket?
 
  • Like
Reactions: najo

najo

Mortarch of the Dark Soul
True Blood
Dec 23, 2012
2,046
Oregon
Historical wargaming has been going on for longer than warhammer fantasy and its settings have always been the same, no one seems to mind.
The whole purpose of historical wargaming is to be accurate to history and recreate those battles to some degree. The very part of it being historical limits the setting.

Fantasy wargaming is creative and dwells in the imagination. It is open for people to add their own creations to some extent or another. It's completely polar opposite in some regards.
 

Blutsauger

Vampire Count
Apr 10, 2013
1,089
God, Planar Shards are so lame.

First things first, the WHFB world is a setting, not a story. It should exist so that other people can create stories within it.

Second...

"Building your own narrative" has ALWAYS been core to the philosophy of GW's games. However WHFB is hamstrung by their stagnant world with its defined borders and lack of mystery. Bretonnia can only expand by conquering parts of the Empire or Tilea/Estonia. You need to go through mental gymnastics to justify why Tomb Kings and Lizardmen are fighting a campaign against each other, and on that medieval city board nonetheless.

I think you're thinking way too big. When I play my Bretonnian army, I don't play as all of Bretonnia. I play as my little Fiefdom set in a forest near some major castle somewhere. I don't need to conquer parts of the Empire to further my story. Likewise, it's easy enough to come up with a reason why Wood Elves and Tomb Kings might be fighting. Yes, the borders of the world are set in stone, but they aren't fleshed out. The maps leave lots of grey areas and I'm free to fill them in how I wish. This is what appeals to me, building my own little kingdom within the scope of a much larger and established fantasy world.

Part of 40K's attraction is that there are effectively no borders. The writers can slot in huge campaigns and crusades where hundreds of planets change hands, and no one has their 'territory' significantly impacted. It's not like Fantasy where if Nuln is destroyed, then my Nuln themed Empire army suddenly become a group of refugees. Fantasy and 40K are different in this regard, and I think that's good. Sometimes I like the blandness of galaxy spanning conflicts where, regardless of who wins and who loses, nothing changes and sometimes I prefer the more structured world of WHFB where I can capture towns and cities, but only on the fringes and grey areas of the map where it won't impact anything. In both instances, nothing actually changes.

Why do I think GW will fuck it up? Because apart from the End Times books, their track record is a laundry list of failures and stuff ups. This bubblehammer thing seems to be the way they've decided to advance the story, and IMO it's fundamentally flawed. No matter how well written or how well executed, it's still going to suck. No matter how much you polish a turd, it's still a turd. I'm just hoping everyone has got the rumours wrong.
 

najo

Mortarch of the Dark Soul
True Blood
Dec 23, 2012
2,046
Oregon
I don't think we are going to get bubble hammer. I think most of the world will be an apocalyptic version of the warhammer setting with new political powers forming from the old setting and then there will be story elements in place that allow for time/space/planar things to occur. Warp storms, rifts in the realm of chaos and places tied to the winds of magic etc.
 

Yorga

Vampire Count
True Blood
Apr 7, 2011
1,844
The whole purpose of historical wargaming is to be accurate to history and recreate those battles to some degree. The very part of it being historical limits the setting.

Fantasy wargaming is creative and dwells in the imagination. It is open for people to add their own creations to some extent or another. It's completely polar opposite in some regards.

So why do all the characters and nations have to be nuked in order to add your own creations. I have seen Warhammer armies bases on the far and wide of creativity. I've seen Monty Python and the Holy Grail Armies. I've seen Army of Darkness (Evil Dead) themed armies. Armies that are based Game of Thrones. Heck I've even seen Jack the Pumpkin King armies. GW usually writes about a thousand years of history for each book. That way if you want to play the original civil war between Dark Elves and High Elves you can. Or the War of the Beard. People have and will use whatever their imagination conjures.

But what will we be left with if they nuke the current universe and cannot refer to the history of the races for fear of owing Rick Priestly some royalties? How will Bubbles be a richer more story based environment for us? o.o
 

najo

Mortarch of the Dark Soul
True Blood
Dec 23, 2012
2,046
Oregon
So why do all the characters and nations have to be nuked in order to add your own creations. I have seen Warhammer armies bases on the far and wide of creativity. I've seen Monty Python and the Holy Grail Armies. I've seen Army of Darkness (Evil Dead) themed armies. Armies that are based Game of Thrones. Heck I've even seen Jack the Pumpkin King armies. GW usually writes about a thousand years of history for each book. That way if you want to play the original civil war between Dark Elves and High Elves you can. Or the War of the Beard. People have and will use whatever their imagination conjures.

But what will we be left with if they nuke the current universe and cannot refer to the history of the races for fear of owing Rick Priestly some royalties? How will Bubbles be a richer more story based environment for us? o.o
I like to see the evidence that backs up the Rick Priestly theory.

That aside, nuking the setting let's them change the generic elements into IP specific ones that they can keep other companies from copying. Like warmahordes, warhammer will end up with a distinct look and feel. It will still be fantasy, but it's own version with most of the generic elements gone. Some of us won't like it, but it will likely attract more players and in the long run be better for the game. Personally, as long as some of the elements are there (skeletons in undead, elven archers, etc) they can IP all the rest up for all I care. So far I'm impressed with the blightkings, storm fiends, morghasts etc.
 
Nov 13, 2013
927
Vancouver, Canada
Part of 40K's attraction is that there are effectively no borders. The writers can slot in huge campaigns and crusades where hundreds of planets change hands, and no one has their 'territory' significantly impacted. It's not like Fantasy where if Nuln is destroyed, then my Nuln themed Empire army suddenly become a group of refugees. Fantasy and 40K are different in this regard, and I think that's good. Sometimes I like the blandness of galaxy spanning conflicts where, regardless of who wins and who loses, nothing changes and sometimes I prefer the more structured world of WHFB where I can capture towns and cities, but only on the fringes and grey areas of the map where it won't impact anything. In both instances, nothing actually changes.

Planar shards and the WH40K universe are effectively the same thing. I don't see your reasoning for preferring one but not the other, save that you seem attached to the traditional setting. Which is cool...it's still there. You can still play in it.

It's like when WotC transitioned to the "points of light" setting, compared to the more defined settings of Eberron or Forgotten Realms. The latter two settings were so well-established that many DMs felt constrained by the over-developed setting. So they created "Points of Light," a setting with a few described cultures and settlements but with most everything else left to the discretion of the DM.

I expect that "bubblehammer" will be similar. A core number of planar shards (or whatever they are) will be well developed and described in the BRB and armybooks, while much of the rest of the world will be a shifting landscape left malleable in the hands of players looking to forge their own narratives.

And again...if you don't like it, you can stick with the old fluff. It's preserved for you in the same state it's been for decades...just how you like it.

Why do I think GW will fuck it up? Because apart from the End Times books, their track record is a laundry list of failures and stuff ups. This bubblehammer thing seems to be the way they've decided to advance the story, and IMO it's fundamentally flawed. No matter how well written or how well executed, it's still going to suck. No matter how much you polish a turd, it's still a turd. I'm just hoping everyone has got the rumours wrong.

Apart from the End Times, and the wealth of backstory in BRBs, armybooks, and novels, all of which contributed to a setting that you are apparently quite fond of?


Whatever their history, GW has gotten their hands on some good fluff writers. The End Times books have been excellent, and are considered so by the vast majority of WHFB fandom. These books have clearly been leading to something, and it is quite frankly entirely illogical to assume that the same loving treatment hasn't been given to whatever that ultimate destination might be.
 

Blutsauger

Vampire Count
Apr 10, 2013
1,089
Planar shards and the WH40K universe are effectively the same thing. I don't see your reasoning for preferring one but not the other, save that you seem attached to the traditional setting. Which is cool...it's still there. You can still play in it.

There's a time and a place for each. I play lots of different wargames, and I expect different things from each of them. WHFB is the best fantasy ruleset and setting out there, and there are certain things it does that I appreciate. It has a generic fantasy world of elves, dwarves, humans and orcs. It has enough of it's own stories and characters to give it a unique twist, but is also empty enough that I can fill in the gaps without feeling like I'm treading on someone else's toes. I have zero interest in a 'planar shards' or bubble worlds setting, because when I think of a fantasy setting, that's not even close to what I imagine. I want a large, generic and stable world that closely mirrors the generic fantasy/medieval settings, so that I can tell my own little stories within that world. I do not want my own little bubble or shard, despite the fact that I could write my own stories within that shard. That has no appeal to me at all.

I also don't want some apocalyptic wasteland fantasy world with whole realms shattered and given over to magical destruction, ala the current Sylvania. That also holds no appeal to me at all.

And yes, I have no fear of 9th edition because if I don't like it, then I will just continue to play 8th. I just hope I don't have to.

Whatever their history, GW has gotten their hands on some good fluff writers. The End Times books have been excellent, and are considered so by the vast majority of WHFB fandom. These books have clearly been leading to something, and it is quite frankly entirely illogical to assume that the same loving treatment hasn't been given to whatever that ultimate destination might be.

Remember how people thought the same thing before the Phantom Menace was released?

Like I said before, no matter how much you polish a turd, it's still just a turd.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dakaar

najo

Mortarch of the Dark Soul
True Blood
Dec 23, 2012
2,046
Oregon
You can't compare Phantom Menace to End Times like that. People have liked End Times so far. Its logical that since we all have enjoyed the Warhammer setting, most of us have liked End Times, then 9th's Newhammer setting should be good. If Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones had been good, then Revenge of the Sith terrible, you'd have a fair point. But alas, Phantom Menace was a huge let down after waiting 16 years. In fact, the Special Editions even gave us all concern ironically. I supposed we could compare End Times Magic to the flubs in Special Edition, I will grant you that. In which case, 9th and Phantom would be comparable.

But whatever. We just need to remain hopeful.
 

Titcher

Skeleton
May 28, 2014
61
God, Planar Shards are so lame.

First things first, the WHFB world is a setting, not a story. It should exist so that other people can create stories within it.

Second...



I think you're thinking way too big. When I play my Bretonnian army, I don't play as all of Bretonnia. I play as my little Fiefdom set in a forest near some major castle somewhere. I don't need to conquer parts of the Empire to further my story. Likewise, it's easy enough to come up with a reason why Wood Elves and Tomb Kings might be fighting. Yes, the borders of the world are set in stone, but they aren't fleshed out. The maps leave lots of grey areas and I'm free to fill them in how I wish. This is what appeals to me, building my own little kingdom within the scope of a much larger and established fantasy world.

Part of 40K's attraction is that there are effectively no borders. The writers can slot in huge campaigns and crusades where hundreds of planets change hands, and no one has their 'territory' significantly impacted. It's not like Fantasy where if Nuln is destroyed, then my Nuln themed Empire army suddenly become a group of refugees. Fantasy and 40K are different in this regard, and I think that's good. Sometimes I like the blandness of galaxy spanning conflicts where, regardless of who wins and who loses, nothing changes and sometimes I prefer the more structured world of WHFB where I can capture towns and cities, but only on the fringes and grey areas of the map where it won't impact anything. In both instances, nothing actually changes.

Why do I think GW will fuck it up? Because apart from the End Times books, their track record is a laundry list of failures and stuff ups. This bubblehammer thing seems to be the way they've decided to advance the story, and IMO it's fundamentally flawed. No matter how well written or how well executed, it's still going to suck. No matter how much you polish a turd, it's still a turd. I'm just hoping everyone has got the rumours wrong.

What are the flaws?
 

Titcher

Skeleton
May 28, 2014
61
So why not make your plane/Bubble/floating rock a large one with numerous cities and armies in defined borders that you create? You can even make it just like the warhammer world pre End times.

Or your small plane/Bubble/Floating Rock gets sucked into a warp and falls back in time.
 

HERO

Wight King
Mar 25, 2009
434
I'm leaning towards that only Lustria, parts of Lustria and Lizardmen specifically will be in the bubbleverse.
 
Nov 13, 2013
927
Vancouver, Canada
i agree 8th is pretty good. On the other hand, i feel 7th ed 40k is an absolute mess, and in no way an improvement on 6th, which i didnt like more than 5th, and i wouldnt really choose over 4th if it were up to me, at least not in terms of core game rules. Yet 40k sells fine for gw while fantasy is apparently so stagnant as to need a total overhaul. As such i am actually quite worried by the possibility of gw deciding they should make fantasy's rules more like the 40k.

Someone on Warseer made a really good point about this.

The fact that WHFB is getting a shakeup does NOT necessarily mean that sales are stagnant. WH40K is the dominant sci-fi tabletop game, selling head-and-shoulders above the rest. Other than infinity there really isn't a huge amount of competition on that front. WHFB, on the other hand, competes in a very vibrant market of fantasy and steampunk miniature games, and is slowly losing marketshare as its competitors grow stronger.

Thus it's likely that the reason for the shakeup isn't that Fantasy sales are flagging objectively, but that it's clear that GW isn't fully realizing the potential of the market for its product.

That's where this shakeup seems headed to me. The End Times doesn't seem like the play of a desperate company trying to rescue a product so much as a company strategically pouring resources into a product with significant growth potential.
 

About us

  • Our community has been around for many years and pride ourselves on offering unbiased, critical discussion among people of all different backgrounds. We are working every day to make sure our community is one of the best.

Quick Navigation

User Menu