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Flesh eaters battle tome!!!

Discussion in 'Gateway to the Realms' started by Lord Elpus, May 2, 2016.

  1. Lord Elpus

    Lord Elpus Ghoul

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  2. Oppenheimer

    Oppenheimer Crypt Horror

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    Ohhhh nice. No new models though :-(
     
  3. Lord Elpus

    Lord Elpus Ghoul

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    Well, maybe not yet;)
     
  4. Malisteen

    Malisteen Vampire Count True Blood

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    Usually for AoS new models, if any, either come out the same time as their battletome or the week before. Plus there's a big box set that doesn't list anything new (unless we're getting a new varghulf, but I doubt that).

    We're getting a new unit - 'crypt flayers' - but model-wise they're just crypt horrors with the vargheist wings, which is... well, I find it a bit annoying. What's next, a new chaos unit that's just putting the arms on backwards? But whatever, it's new fluff, and almost certainly a handful of new ghoul-themed formations, so that's cool.

    Still nothing actually new for the undead in age of sigmar, though. Not that our end times releases were THAT long ago, but this really isn't going to change the fact that our 'grand alliance' can still hardly justify a claim on either of those words.


    That's... way more negative sounding than I really intended. I'm underwhelmed by the lack of model releases, but still excited to see some attention for the undead. I was expecting ogre kingdoms to be featured this week, so this is an unexpected bonus.
     
  5. Borgnine

    Borgnine Moderator Staff Member True Blood

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    Well, destruction didn't get anything new during End Times, so they were much more in need than us ;) But still, I understand you - we are as much behind chaos as chaos is behind khorne alone.

    Also, I'm eagerly waiting for the time when all the units will get those round bases and formations, so these excuses for a release would stop :frown:

    EDIT: And those crypt horrors with wings are for real? As a new unit? Then maybe they'll make Vargheists with crypt horror hands. FOUR possible units in a single box!
     
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  6. Menkeroth

    Menkeroth A Knight of Blood

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    Aye, the new book is always welcome, though ghouls are not that deep or interesting either, but why not, not bad anyway. But these "new" models... GW lacks imagination on ghouls? Hardly surprising, but still...
     
  7. Oppenheimer

    Oppenheimer Crypt Horror

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    The flayers look so lame ughhhhh
     
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  8. Menkeroth

    Menkeroth A Knight of Blood

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    To say the least. Not that original, especially considering the fact that they put Varghulfs in the ranks of the flesh eaters.
     
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  9. Oppenheimer

    Oppenheimer Crypt Horror

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    Maybe I'll just put vargheists in with my flesh eaters and declare then flayers for synergy reasons. Sure not building any more of those guys.
     
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  10. Menkeroth

    Menkeroth A Knight of Blood

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    All in pre-order!
     
  11. El Syf

    El Syf Crypt Horror

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    3 new units out of what is already a double kit! Bit sure how I feel about this...
     
  12. Menkeroth

    Menkeroth A Knight of Blood

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    Too lazy for them? Bestimmt, but they've made at least something for ghouls, which can't be said for other such factions :(
     
  13. El Syf

    El Syf Crypt Horror

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    True, it's quite cost effective for GW to do this as well since all they need to do is supply round bases. Just odd there wasn't some overly expensive centre piece model...
     
  14. Menkeroth

    Menkeroth A Knight of Blood

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    Aye, that's really strange. But maybe it's reserved for returned ghoul king / vampire lord mounted?
     
  15. Count michael

    Count michael The Undead Sparky

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    Flayers are just Vargheists with a different name. quite happy the ghouls now come in a box of 20 opposed to the old 10 packs, ghoul formation seems a good deal as well. Just a shame no new models as vampire counts getting the age of sigmar treatment would of been nice
     
  16. Lord Elpus

    Lord Elpus Ghoul

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    Just been looking at the app, there's also a Crypt Ghast Courtier (normal looking Ghoul champ), not bad abilities, then there's the Crypt Haunter, a Crypt Horror with a Vargheist head, agian not bad abilities.. Following on from this is the Crypt Infernal Courtier.. Single model, looks like the Crypt Horror with wings but also the Vargheist hairy back; breath attack,Muster Royal Guard is nice! I would go into detail, but I'm not sure what I can and cannot write, hence I'm a tad vague.. Sorry!!
     
  17. Malisteen

    Malisteen Vampire Count True Blood

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    All the rules are up on the website, at least in the UK. Good to hear they're on the app, too.

    Crypt Horrors look the same to me, but as mentioned they get a hero version. Model-wise, it's a crypt horror with a vargheist head. I already modeled my horror champ with a vargheist head and one vargheist wing, so I guess I'll just call him that. Instead of all his attacks being 2 damage, with 3 damage on sixes to hit, like normal horrors, he just has three attacks that are three damage always and two that are one damage always. Kind of a wash there. Still regens a wound a turn, and re-rolls hits for nearby ghoul kings, but his big ability is that you roll 6 dice, and for every 5+ you add a model to a nearby crypt horror unit of your choice. Very impressive. Make sure you keep him out of los, he's going to be a high priority target.

    The Flayers are crypt horrors with vargheist wings (or, alternatively, vargheists with crypt horror backs and heads). I know several players out there already assembled their vargheists with crypt horror backs because they didn't like the fur anyway. they're fast, they fly, 1 damage attacks with rend -1, and have the spirit hosts 'mortal wound on 6 to hit instead of normal damage' ability. They each have a mini terrorgheist scream at d6+1. Only even capable of harming leadership 6 or less units as a result, but it's something.

    The Flayers have their own hero version, modeled as the vargheist champ (the back with two extra little wings) but with the ghoul champ's head (the one with the big ring through his neck). I'm sure we can come up with better conversions. He has a d3 damage breath attack instead of the mini scream, 2 damage melee attacks (including 2 mortal wounds on a six to hit), and the same 'roll 6 dice, add a model to a nearby unit for every 5+' ability as the horror hero, but for flayers instead. An impressive hero, rules wise, though again you'll need to hide him until you're ready to charge, which may be rather difficult.


    Additionally, the 'Varghulf' is now a 'Varghulf Courtier' hero. I'm not sure if this replaces the original Varghulf, or is in addition to it. The varghulf courtier is fast, flies, has 5 attacks (7 if within 3" of at least 10 enemy models after piling in) - one at d3 damage w/ -2 rend and the rest at 2 damage and -1. It re-rolls to hit if a friendly flesh-eater courts wizard cast a spell w/in 18 inches of it that turn, heals d3 wounds at the end of any combat phase in which it slew any enemy models. Most of all, it has its own version of the model summoning rule of the flayer and horror heroes, rolling 6 dice in your hero phase and for every 2+ you add a model to a ghoul unit.


    Overall, the new Courtier heroes seem to be there to give ghoul armies that undead recursion theme that is otherwise missing due to the lack of banners in the army.


    All in all, I like the new units rules-wise, but the lack of actual new models (a dual kit horror/flamer hero and a plastic vargheist at least would have been nice) is a little discouraging. Still, all in all not a bad lot, and the Ghoul Host army box is a solid discount and looks like a pretty playable army out of the gate.



    Oh, also there's a change to the Ghoul King on Terrorgheist. It regends d3 wounds every turn - maybe it did that before, I forget? But it also has a new command ability, which summons 3 crypt horrors or flayers anywhere on the table more than 9" from an enemy unit, and they cannot move in the following movement phase.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2016
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  18. Sharkbelly

    Sharkbelly Wight King

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    I like it! I used to run 30 ghouls in my VC army, as well as 3 vargheists. Also had a ghoul king with wings. All of those should fit in nicely...
     
  19. Lord Elpus

    Lord Elpus Ghoul

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    There's also a ghoul king on zombie dragon too!
     
  20. Malisteen

    Malisteen Vampire Count True Blood

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    Neat, I hadn't noticed that!

    The GK on ZD has the stats and abilities you would expect, including healing d3 wounds a turn. It has a really impressive spell, cast on a 6 to re-roll wounds for all flesh eater court models within 10 inches. The command ability summons one courtier (the horror, flayer, and varghulf heroes who in turn can add models to existing horror, flayer, and ghoul units), which is actually pretty impressive. You can't move that movement phase, but nothing stops the summoned courtier from in turn adding an average of 2 horrors or flayers, or 5 ghouls to existing units.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2016
  21. Oppenheimer

    Oppenheimer Crypt Horror

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    They got rid of the Beasts of the Grave faction from the alliance book and moved the unridden zombie dragon and the unridden terrorgheist to flesh eaters, even changing their key words. Why didn't they do this before the alliance book :-( now it's already outdated.

    I don't know what the difference between the Crypt Ghoul champion (Crypt Ghast) is and the Crypt Ghast Courtier (modelling wise)

    The Vargulf has now been changed twice. It in the origional pdf for VC it was any number of models. Then they change it to single models in the alliance book. Now the Vargulf Courtier cannot be summoned. It does replace the regular Varghulf in the app.

    I'm actually pretty confused by all of these things. So many different heads of different models.

    Edit: Gah! Now can't summon Crypt Horrors. They also changed the names of the crypt horror abilities to make them sound less canibalistic. Which is dumb based on how they modelled.

    Edit 2: Actually you can't summon anything in flesh eaters through spells, they can only be created by the various abilities everyone has to do so (and there are a ton of new abilities that do that)
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2016
  22. Menkeroth

    Menkeroth A Knight of Blood

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    So the ghoul kings are now less magical in the vampire sense?
     
  23. Oppenheimer

    Oppenheimer Crypt Horror

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    GK can still cast spells, some are different than before. No one can summon any of the flesh eaters anymore except the various "courier" hero versions of the various units.
     
  24. Lord Elpus

    Lord Elpus Ghoul

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    But I need to be able to summon a lone Zombie Dragon :swear: just because..
     
  25. Malisteen

    Malisteen Vampire Count True Blood

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    Yeah, it's a bit weird, especially for the zombie dragon, which, if it was going to be moved out of beasts of the grave, you think it would have been put in the dead-walkers faction.

    Also, neither of the unridden monsters is summonable anymore, though the terrorgheist heals d3 wounds a turn if near a ghoul king. While I don't think summonable big monsters was great for the game, I wish there had at least been a spell for healing the zombie dragon, like with the sphinxes.

    Officially, the Crypt Ghast Courtier (Hero) is a Crypt Ghast (Crypt Horror Champion), but with the head of a vargheist. In practice, though, it will be any Crypt horror conversion or variant paint job that makes it stand out more from the regular unit.

    Yeah, this is a lot of changes a bit too close together for my taste. I do think this version is an improvement, both thematically and mechanicaly, but still.

    Yeah, I could forgive the Crypt Flayers, but there really should have been a separate dual-kit model for the hero versions.


    I feel this is in part the first of a series of moves away from summoning as we've known it. I don't think they're going to eliminate summoning altogether, but I do think it's going to be toned down a lot in terms of what can be summoned, and how much, and by what. And honestly, that's probably a good thing overall.

    Just a shame we're the first to be hit with this particular nerf stick, as daemons, particularly tzeentch daemons, are a lot worse, imo.

    Anyway, as it is, death no longer has access to any summonable monsters, iirc, apart from the forgeworld thing. Granted, the forgeworld thing is a particularly heinous monstrosity....
     

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