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Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,727
1679540558811.png

Stream's Down: but you can see the new Death stuff previewed on Warhammer Community: https://www.warhammer-community.com...ght-gravelords-heroes-rise-from-their-graves/

What I was thinking going in:

IIRC, the last time there were rumors with any air of credibility, they suggested the following for Death releases that might be announced here:
  • New OBR battletome, but only a pity hero for new models.
  • New FEC battletome, with a pity hero plus a new medium ghouls unit with melee and ranged options.
So that's what we've got our fingers crossed for. Doesn't sound like much, but imo anything more than books & pity heroes should be considered gifts from Nagash. I certainly don't think we've seen any particularly large pile of yet unexplained rumor engine pics that would justify hoping for more than that. Heck, we might not see anything at all for Death tonight. So yeah, expectations should be set pretty low.

Hard to keep hopes down, though, given how much untapped potential there is in the OBR range, and how much unmet need in the FEC range.

What we actually got:

...


First announcement is the dark angels primarch. Not undead, but dang he looks good.

Second is a Horus Heresy campaign book. Still waiting on AoS

....

And the age of sigmar preview is... seraphon? Wait, didn't their book already come out? No? Well, don't I have egg on my face!

New cold one riders & kroxigors. They do look very nice.

...

Wait, no, there is some death news...


The 2 Spring Death books are officially announced: Ossiarch Bonereapers and Soulblight Gravelords, both with a single new hero.


.....



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New OBR pity hero, buffs elites/monsters/monstrous infanty?

...

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New Vyrkos named small hero. Because that's what soulblight needed more of. :p

I can't be bitter, though. She looks cool.

...

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So, the Death books are OBR and Soulblight, not OBR and FEC. And while the rumors had suggested a Soulblight update later in the year, this is not the model support that was supposed to go with it, so I think we can put those rumors to bed.

I'm ok waiting longer for FEC, if it means there might still be hope for a more complete range revamp & expansion, as they dearly need it. OBR has a lot of untapped potential for expansion, but what they need most critically right now is an in depth rules revamp, so I can't be /too/ mad about the pity hero treatment. Will definitely be looking with interest towards future articles that might indicate how much the new battletome will change. Same with Soulblight, I really had my fingers crossed for new grave guard, but the main thing they need is just a slight rulebook update incorporating the white dwarf update.

...

Tzeentch and Sigmarines for the new underworlds season. Is it really time for a new box set/season? It feels like the very last release was the box w/ the grave guard warband?

...

And of course, 10th edition 40k. Ultramarines vs. Tyranids, not Blood Angels. Some interesting news, including fully free rules on day one. Not on topic here, though.

...

So, with the previous rumor pile dead, what's the future look like for AoS releases?

55nlec2qtepa1.png

So the undead books are still the next ones. Seraphon out in summer, along with a new ghb - I'm straight done buying those. I haven't bought the current one, and I'm glad I didn't because I've played, what, four games since it came out? I won't even get to each of the matched play scenarios before the whole book is defunct. I used to happily buy every ghb, but a significant price rise coupled with 6 month seasons just kills it for me.

Anyway, that aside, Cities of Sigmar out in autumn, and two additional yet unannounced books, one in summer and one in autumn. Unless I missed something, we don't know anything about them yet, so more death this year could still be possible.

...

I've got more to say here, stuff that mostly amounts to "these new hero models are cool, but they're also about objectively the furthest you could get from anything their factions actually needed or wanted" only said with a lot more words than that, but it's going on 1am and I've got work in the morning, so that'll have to wait.
 
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Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,727
I lied, I have to get the whinging out before I can go to sleep.

...

Rumors aside, I wasn't expecting anything more than the standard 'pity' hero with the two Spring books, not with the major Seraphon and Cities revamps plus 10th edition 40k this year. But that said, even for pity heroes these are rather piteous. Don't get me wrong, they both look amazing, but 'another vykos dynasty named hero' and 'another generic obr infantry caster' are literally as far as you could possibly get from what these factions might want or need or find exciting. Like you could not come up with less exciting concepts if you tried.

If they wanted to give OBR a morghast support hero, which seems to be this guy's gimmick, why not an actual morghast hero? Or if that would have been too large, why not an infantry liege, since currently the only generic liege is mounted, while there are already 5 40mm-or-smaller base OBR casters, if you count the special character & underworlds model, two of which already don't see any use due to the overcrowding of that niche.

If they wanted to add another subfaction-locked named vampire, why not one for literally any of the other bloodlines, which currently only have their big game monster bosses? Or if they desperately needed something vaguely vyrkos themed, because everything new has to be vyrkos for some reason, then why not a generic version of the gravedigger named character from the Ulfenkarn box? Zombies are actually popular in the army now, it would be nice if they had a dedicated hero to go with them that wasn't named, subfaction-locked, and currently dead in the canon lore. And is there really some rule saying pity heroes have to be infantry? Because it is /still/ downright shameful that the same book that finally gave us plastic blood knights also /took away/ the cavalry vampire lords who should have been riding into battle alongside them, so if there's one hero model that the faction sorely needs, it's that.

They're giving us what has become the bare minimum, but in a way that feels like going out of their way to give us even less than that. Is this what Ogre players felt when their pity hero was a worse alternative to their already rarely played infantry beast hunter guy?

Which is all particularly a shame because, apart from all that, just looking at them as a couple new models, these two are pretty fantastic. Like, I hate that these are the models we're getting, but setting that aside I really love both of them.

...

There was one notable surprise here in that the expected death books weren't Ossiarch Bonereapers and Soulblight Gravelords, but rather OBR and Flesh Eater Courts. Partially a shame, because FEC need the rules update much more than SBGL do. On the other hand, FEC even more desperately need a significant revamp and expansion to their model range, a pity hero absolutely will not cut it. If they're not coming now, then at least there's still hope that when they do arrive we might see a proper model wave for them.
 
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Celeritas

Skeleton
Feb 3, 2011
50
Don't disagree with anything you've said here. My only hope is that this won't be the last announcement as far as new models for both armies goes - in particular, if they don't use this as an opportunity to at the very least redo Grave Guard I'll be amazed.

Very excited to see what's in the new books though
 
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Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,727
Alright, I've had a sleep, and I'm feeling less salty.

Soulblight: We're a couple years out now from the 2nd edition army book release, so it's a bit harder to remember now, but the 2e book did come with an absolutely huge range overhaul. The Grave Guard are a sore point, as is the lack of a cavalry vamp lord, but apart from that the range really doesn't need anything, and the rules still mostly hold up. It'll be nice to not need to haul an issue of white dwarf around alongside the battletome - that's all the gravelords really need, so good. Really nothing to complain about here. Sure

The new Vyrkos named infantry hero is an odd choice, but the faction really doesn't need any new infantry heroes, so whatever. She's gravy. You could treat her as another limited edition model, just a nice looking display piece, and in that light she's fine if you like her and can be ignored if you don't.

Worth pointing out - while the old grave guard are a sore point, there is a potential replacement for them that does have nice new models - the new warcry warband. If their rules don't change much in the new book, they are a solid alternative for infantry glass hammer, particularly in legion of Night and Kastelai where at least currently they benefit from subfaction rules.

.....

As for OBR - yes, this is a low key release. But their existing range was already a pretty impressive showing for a brand new faction only one edition ago. As I'm always reminding myself, it's easy to look at lumineth and start to feel jealous, but if you look at fyreslayers or KO it helps put things in perspective.

And narratively, now really just isn't the OBR's time. Nagash is out of the picture. Arkhan is out of the picture. Katakros is fighting to hold existing territory, not currently expanding. OBR certainly needs more than Gravelords, but what we need most is new rules to make our faction's special rules play more nicely with the 3rd edition core rules. It's too soon to say we're definitely going to get what we need here, but hope is absolutely still strong.

As for the new model, yeah, another mortisan is /not/ what this faction needed or wanted, but the particular specialty of this mortisan? Healing and Buffing our big stuff - stalkers, immortis, morghasts, harvesters, and crawlers? That's quite appreciated. Plus, they just looks really cool. In particular, I like their gribbly little fingers, that look like they're twisting and contorting to perform the somatic components of complicated necromantic rituals that no mortal could perform. I like their back plate with the boney tendrils extending from it. The model really captures the themes I love about the faction as a whole.

...

So yeah, can't deny that I would have been /more/ excited for /other/ new hero choices, but I'm not /unhappy/ as it is.

Definitely looking with interest towards future warcom articles previewing the new battletomes. Also crossing my fingers hard that we'll see something more substantial when the FEC get their day.
 
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Kiba

Skeleton
Jun 20, 2013
53
The two red books may be new narrative ones, maybe with news units like the Broken realms ones.

That's would "revalidate" the rumors, the news units would be in these rather than the BT.
 

Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,727
It really wouldn't though, as the rumors pretty firmly put soulblight out in autumn, and didn't predict another vyrkos named hero at all. I think we can reasonably call those rumors guesses & speculation, and disregard them going forward.

And good thing too, because it opens up room to hope for more for FEC, who really do need more than they were rumored to be getting.
 

The Sun King

Moderator
Staff member
True Blood
Aug 22, 2012
4,993
Copenhagen
So... I have previously been ranting about how much I hoped that FEC would be one of the two books coming out in spring...

But! I am actually excited that this is not the case. My reasons are:

1. The new Seraphon are fucking amazing. Probably the best sculpts GW had ever done. So thos summer I will go back to playing Lizardmen with the new model range.

2. Cities of Sigmar has me hyped as well so I will probably dabble with that as well.

3. Looking at the tournament scene SBG is really falling behind. The book is simply not powerful enough compared to 3e books. Think about it this way: SBG should be the army of recursion... but most new 3e books have way better recursion in the form of 4+ Rally and summons.
Hopefully, a new book will get SBG back competitively and it I am itching to go back to playing my Vampires again.

So, in total I am actually extremely excited right now. Excited to return to my beloved vampires and looking forward to summer to start a new Lizard army (I sold my old one 😉).
 

Gederas

Grave Guard
Jun 15, 2021
208
Rhode Island
So I'm excited for the new tome, and I like the new character's sculpt. One quibble:

Did we REALLY NEED ANOTHER FOOT HERO? Gravelords now has more foot heroes than some armies have warscrolls 🤣
 
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The Sun King

Moderator
Staff member
True Blood
Aug 22, 2012
4,993
Copenhagen
Yeah it is weird with the foot hero spam... And even weirder that they gave Vyrkos another named character. Would have been better with some love for the other dynasties but well, beggars cant be choosers and the model is Hella cool.
 

Gederas

Grave Guard
Jun 15, 2021
208
Rhode Island
a similar fate to Fyreslayer, if I'm not wrong. 😜
Fyreslayers was one of the armies I was referring to. Gravelords have more Foot Heroes than Fyreslayers, Flesh-Eater Courts and Ironjawz have units.

Yeah it is weird with the foot hero spam... And even weirder that they gave Vyrkos another named character. Would have been better with some love for the other dynasties but well, beggars cant be choosers and the model is Hella cool.
An actual model for Prince Vhodrai would be great. Or better yet: Vampire Lord on Nightmare (alt build, Necromancer on Steed)
 
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Gederas

Grave Guard
Jun 15, 2021
208
Rhode Island
So I just did the math:

The reveal from Adepticon for the Soulblight Gravelords battletome's "Pittance Model", now brings the Soulblight Gravelords battletome to a whopping FOURTEEN FOOT HEROES. Fifteen if you count the special release Anastasia Malkoran model.

Going off the 15 count....

That is as many foot heroes as units as:
- Daughters of Khaine
- Idoneth Deepkin
- Kharadron Overlords

That is more units than:
- Fyreslayers
- Sylvaneth
- Flesh-Eater Courts
- Sons of Behemat
- Each subfaction for Orruk Warclans (Ironjawz-9, Kruelboyz-12, Bonezplittas-9)

And that's just for AoS. They also have more foot heroes than a lot of 40k armies too 🤣
 
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Unas the slayer

Moderator
Staff member
Jan 1, 2017
1,890
Northern Italy
So I just did the math:

The reveal from Adepticon for the Soulblight Gravelords battletome's "Pittance Model", now brings the Soulblight Gravelords battletome to a whopping FOURTEEN FOOT HEROES. Fifteen if you count the special release Anastasia Malkoran model.

Going off the 15 count....

That is as many foot heroes as units as:
- Daughters of Khaine
- Idoneth Deepkin
- Kharadron Overlords

That is more units than:
- Fyreslayers
- Sylvaneth
- Flesh-Eater Courts
- Sons of Behemat
- Each subfaction for Orruk Warclans (Ironjawz-9, Kruelboyz-12, Bonezplittas-9)

And that's just for AoS. They also have more foot heroes than a lot of 40k armies too 🤣

A case could be made that the army is composed by mindless bodies, so the uniqueness of the lore for each army comes from the variety of the Vampire Lords that lead it.

(but yeah, that's excessive nonetheless)
 
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The Sun King

Moderator
Staff member
True Blood
Aug 22, 2012
4,993
Copenhagen
Yeah 15 foot heroes are a bit excessive, but except for the Grave Guard I don't really feel that SBG needs a model refresh, so I don't mind getting a random foot hero. I would like them to put effort into an eventual FEC launch. I would be quite disturbed if they didn't get a model refresh. 🤞🤞🤞
 

Celeritas

Skeleton
Feb 3, 2011
50
What do we think is the likelihood of new models being announced for SBG in the run up to the release of the battletome? Or is it more likely that the Vrykos hero is all we're gonna get?
 

Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,727
From what the presenters said at the adepticon event, the vyrkos hero is all we're getting. It's not impossible that something else might yet be announced, but the odds of it are negligible.
 

Sception

Master Necromancer
True Blood
Sep 23, 2009
2,727
yeah, current range is great. a couple painful gaps - grave guard, mounted vamp lord - & room for other improvements of course, but we're not hurting for models right now, & if a minimum sbgl 3e release was the price for the amazing seraphon update, imo that was a price worth paying.
 

The Sun King

Moderator
Staff member
True Blood
Aug 22, 2012
4,993
Copenhagen
Yeah I agree completely and I have my fingers crossed that no new FEC book = new FEC range when it finally get released.
 

Gederas

Grave Guard
Jun 15, 2021
208
Rhode Island
To be fair we have so many awesome models in the SBG range. What we need is a good battletome. I am already excited for doing a handbook on it 😍
yeah, current range is great. a couple painful gaps - grave guard, mounted vamp lord - & room for other improvements of course, but we're not hurting for models right now, & if a minimum sbgl 3e release was the price for the amazing seraphon update, imo that was a price worth paying.
Yeah, like the only thing I'd say we "need" are updated Grave Guard. Black Knights are stuck how they are due to being a dual-kit with Hexwraiths

Also the weird thing now that I think of it, imo, is the Black Coach not being in the Gravelords as well as Nighthaunt. Like, ffs, the fluff for it is still carrying around a vampire's "corpse" inside it!
 

The Sun King

Moderator
Staff member
True Blood
Aug 22, 2012
4,993
Copenhagen
Yeah the Black Coach should be in SBG as well as the Nighthaunt, but it can ally in. But then it loses its ethereal and ward so it is not really worth it.

I feel the Mortis Engine could be in Nighthaunt as well, but c'est la vie.
 
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