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Corpse Cart Vigor Mortis and multiple combat

Joined
Jan 10, 2014
Messages
18
#1
Okay so I encountered a conflict in how the rules for multiple combats work when playing with my friend the other day.

I was involved in a multiple combat where I had a unit of crypt ghouls/vampire charge his goblins in the front and my varghiests charged his rear. The beefed up hellish vigour spell had gone off in my magic phase from said vampire and I had a corpse cart that was roughly an inch behind my ghouls.

I resolved combat with my ghouls and vampire first as they had ASF. After removing models from the rear (there were a lot of them!) I moved my varghiests into base contact with the now smaller unit and measured 5" from my corpse cart.

Now I believe that My varghiests should have had ASF as they were within 6" of the corpse cart when making their attacks. Having being new and already made some mistakes this game that were in my favour, I conceded and gave up my re rolls to hit on account of me basically already winning the combat and trying not to power and too much. I was however not impressed with his logic that the ASF attacks had already been resolved and therefore I could not "gain" ASF now that the combat had begun. The argument was quite circular. I'm definitely going to be asking a games workshop staff member about this rule when we go next.. We have a list of things but in the meantime I would like to know peoples opinions on this.

If you were in a multiple combat where one of your units was out of range at the start of the combat of your corpse cart when vigor mortis was popped but in range when it was your time to attack with that unit would you assume that a) the Unit had ASF and all of the rules associated with it or b) that the unit does not in fact have ASF as they did not have it at the start of the combat.
 

heldantes

Black Knight
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
393
#2
I hate to be in favour of the obnoxious, but I would play it as that they don't get ASF.

This would be similar if say a unit was 6 inches away from the corpse cart, but crushed a unit and went 2 d6 inches forward into another unit (charge to be resolved in the next combat phase) to then be 6 inches from the corpse cart: I wouldn't say they are now able to benefit from the ASF buff either.
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
Messages
18
#3
Thanks for your input!

Id like to make it clear that I am being pretty open minded here and am not looking for someone to give me the answer that I'm wanting to hear.

Unfortunately I was a little confused by your example. Could be the wording on either end or the reading on mine. Would not be surprised considering the time it is here in Aus.

So I'd like to ask not questioning your understanding of the rules or being obnoxious myself.. You do realise that the unit was outside of the corpse carts bubble (outside of 6") but then moved in within the 6" radius?

Again not getting stuck on my side of the fence I just want to be sure of the clarity :)
 

heldantes

Black Knight
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
393
#4
I get what you're saying. It depends on how you play it:

1) the ASF bubble is instantaneous: it affects those within 6 inches, then disappears (how I see it)

2) the ASF bubble remains and will affect any who move into it
 

Adam_Barrow

Sleepless Knight
True Blood
Joined
Dec 25, 2010
Messages
3,071
#5
Because the ASF initiaive step had already passed, I would assume the Vargs did not get the buff.
 

Demian

Vampire Count
Joined
Oct 28, 2011
Messages
1,248
#6
I'd say the Vigour Mortis effect is activated the moment an augment spell targets the corpse cart.

As the wording says "then all friendly Undead within 6''..." are affected and finally they retain their ASF until the appropiate turn. After that, any Units moving close to the Cart (via... single target VDM for instance) will not be affected.

Curious to say, you can VDM the Cart and after it has moved, all Units within range get Vigour Mortis! hehehe
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
Messages
18
#7
Thank you very much guys :)

Iv actually changed my mind a little now. As nice as it would be to gain it like that it wouldn't make sense for the rules intention if the opposite were true and the combat phase had me "lose" ASF after I moved a unit into base contact due to combat res.

Would not like to feel like some good rolls actually nerfef my combat.

I guess I just figured it was like an inspiring presence bubble. Where the rules made everything within that 6" apply more so to the corpse cart than the models that were initially around them by being continuously tested by a units distance until the effect ended (my next turn or magic phase).

Am now having second thoughts about this way of doing it..
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
Messages
18
#9
Demian said:
I'd say the Vigour Mortis effect is activated the moment an augment spell targets the corpse cart.

As the wording says "then all friendly Undead within 6''..." are affected and finally they retain their ASF until the appropiate turn. After that, any Units moving close to the Cart (via... single target VDM for instance) will not be affected.

Curious to say, you can VDM the Cart and after it has moved, all Units within range get Vigour Mortis! hehehe
Nice tactic with the VDM! Damn that thing is slow.. Might be a nice way to get it moving! Curiously if I use the boosted VDM on every unit within 12" and move the cart first and then VDM another unit out of range would I then still get it?

How about if I used another spell such as IoN and then using VDM on a unit previously in range so that is no longer within 6"?
 

Demian

Vampire Count
Joined
Oct 28, 2011
Messages
1,248
#10
Everytime a spell is resolved (hence the words "succesfully cast") then you check for all Units in range of the Vigour Mortis effect.

So if you AOE VDM and first move the Cart, but then proceed to move all the others you still need to place them within the 6'' Range after resolving the spell for them to benefit from the... "pulse" effect if there is such a therm.

=)
 
Joined
May 17, 2012
Messages
3
#11
since vigor mortis removes always strikes last in zombies and replaces it with always strikes frist, would it also remove always strikes last from grave guard with great weapons and replace it with always strikes first?
 
Joined
Feb 8, 2014
Messages
103
#13
Okay so I encountered a conflict in how the rules for multiple combats work when playing with my friend the other day.

I was involved in a multiple combat where I had a unit of crypt ghouls/vampire charge his goblins in the front and my varghiests charged his rear. The beefed up hellish vigour spell had gone off in my magic phase from said vampire and I had a corpse cart that was roughly an inch behind my ghouls.

I resolved combat with my ghouls and vampire first as they had ASF. After removing models from the rear (there were a lot of them!) I moved my varghiests into base contact with the now smaller unit and measured 5" from my corpse cart.

Now I believe that My varghiests should have had ASF as they were within 6" of the corpse cart when making their attacks. Having being new and already made some mistakes this game that were in my favour, I conceded and gave up my re rolls to hit on account of me basically already winning the combat and trying not to power and too much. I was however not impressed with his logic that the ASF attacks had already been resolved and therefore I could not "gain" ASF now that the combat had begun. The argument was quite circular. I'm definitely going to be asking a games workshop staff member about this rule when we go next.. We have a list of things but in the meantime I would like to know peoples opinions on this.

If you were in a multiple combat where one of your units was out of range at the start of the combat of your corpse cart when vigor mortis was popped but in range when it was your time to attack with that unit would you assume that a) the Unit had ASF and all of the rules associated with it or b) that the unit does not in fact have ASF as they did not have it at the start of the combat.
Think of like this.....combat is ensuing...and in warhammer we do things in initiative order....so your vampire cast a spell, it went off...the corpse cart absorbed all that magical energy and decided it was going to make the ghouls dance. The ghouls start dancing and get all excited at their new partners and decide their going to paint the room red. Now the vargs jump in to clean up....the dance party is already over with so they decide to skulldick the rest of the goblins to show their sadness.
 
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