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Vs ogres and allocating attacks

Noobafrass

Grave Guard
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
276
#1
So we've recently had ogres introduced to our meta and I have to say, they are an interesting army with lots of interesting and cool stuff.

Like the title suggests though, is thread is about the attack allocation. So, say a 3 wide unit of ogres is in combat with a 5 wide unit of anything. Since the front rank of ogres has a unit champ, another command model, and a character, you've got to allocate all your attacks separately and spread them out. I understand that this is an important part of the army strength.

I find this incredibly frustrating. Not just in making my attacks more ineffective (I'd way rather try to go for rank and file than a higher-stat character, for instance), but in having to take the time to figure everything out and roll 3 full sets of attacks instead of one. Every time I face that army, I find myself more and more annoyed by it. To me, it's not compelling gameplay and it's simply not a fun mechanic.

Anybody else think this or have any thoughts on the matter?
 

BloodbathMcGrath

The Butcher of New Liberty
Joined
Sep 9, 2012
Messages
493
#2
I was under the impression all attacks go against RnF, UNLESS you state you are allocating against a specific model.
 
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
342
#3
If some of the models are only in contact with the champion or a char.. They hve to attack them, this includes supporting attacks, all touching the standard bearer will go on the unit, it is a strong tactic..
 

Narenzade

Wight King
Joined
Mar 22, 2012
Messages
465
#4
If he's only three wide then he's giving up a lot of attacks. Also, only the character and the champion will need to have attacks allocated to them. So, you could hit a fair amount of rank and file models.
 

Noobafrass

Grave Guard
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
276
#5
Well it was an example. Often it's 4 wide, sometimes it's 3. The base irritation with the mechanic doesn't change based on the wisdom of his choices though.
 

Johnny-Crass

Vampire Ancient
True Blood
Joined
Jan 25, 2012
Messages
6,640
#6
Its a very commmon tactics for Brets and Ogres. If you have different Isteps then send the higher I into the champion every time. It is very important that you kill the champion
 

Noobafrass

Grave Guard
Joined
Jan 1, 2012
Messages
276
#7
Ya that's what I've been doing, since it opens up more attacks for the RnF guys with whoever takes its place.

My purpose in this post was less to get strategy against it and more to see if anybody found this mechanic fun on either side. Every time I've played against it, it has the sense of, to use a Blizzard/WoW phrase, "Creative Use of Game Mechanics", which is a euphemism for "exploiting".

I realize that it's not and it's in the rules, but that doesn't make me happier about it. I also realize the rules in this game are filled with screwy garbage, but for some reason this one gets me going.
 

rothgar13

Vampire Count
True Blood
Joined
Jan 26, 2012
Messages
1,025
#8
As someone who has been on the other side of the ledger (aka fielded character walls), they are a blast to use because they make that unit so much tougher in CC. Definitely a prime example of an abusable game mechanic, though.
 

Johnny-Crass

Vampire Ancient
True Blood
Joined
Jan 25, 2012
Messages
6,640
#9
You will feel better about the Ogres version when you play the Bretonnian version. Besides killingblow it is impossible to get through that wall xD
 

rothgar13

Vampire Count
True Blood
Joined
Jan 26, 2012
Messages
1,025
#10
Fortunately for VC, though, Killing Blow is there to be had. I'd say that Ogres put up the toughest walls, due to the sheer number of Wounds and Toughness involved, and the fact that of the 4 armies that use this tactic most often (Beastmen with Minotaurs, Brets with Knights, Ogres with Ironguts, O&G with Goblins), the total package of offense, defense, points cost, and availability is the strongest.
 

datalink7

Black Knight
Joined
Aug 30, 2010
Messages
327
#11
rothgar13 said:
Fortunately for VC, though, Killing Blow is there to be had. I'd say that Ogres put up the toughest walls, due to the sheer number of Wounds and Toughness involved, and the fact that of the 4 armies that use this tactic most often (Beastmen with Minotaurs, Brets with Knights, Ogres with Ironguts, O&G with Goblins), the total package of offense, defense, points cost, and availability is the strongest.
I agree. Ogre's are one of my main Armies and I've been known to take an Ogre wall. 2x Bruisers, one with a 3+/5++ and the other with a 5+/4++. Round this out with a Slaughtermaster with Glittering Scales and Fencers Blades and you have a nasty wall that almost nothing can get through. All have T5 of course (minimum, can be pumped with spell).

I put them in a unit of Ironguts. If this champ is still alive I'll mostly leave it 4 wide so they still have to allocate individually. Once the champ dies, reform to 3 wide and leave the wall of super tough characters in place.
 

BloodbathMcGrath

The Butcher of New Liberty
Joined
Sep 9, 2012
Messages
493
#12
While on the topic of character walls, don't VC have it in the form of BK buses? -Also a tough deathstar for opponents to pull down. Especially because it is also self-healing, buffing and often has other casting capabilities. I guess VC's downside is the loss of the characters in our BK buses is devastating to the unit and our army as a whole...
 

eggsPR

Vampire Count
True Blood
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
1,139
#13
Death snipe the champ. If he has a Hellheart, snipe the holder first before he uses it (he won't have a ward save).

If he has rune maw banner, throw a PSun his way - don't forget to make him take a look out sir roll for the champ seperately (many players conveniently forget taking look out sirs for champs).

If you don't have Death Lore, u maybe need to adjust your list, bc it pwns Ogres (and many others).
 
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