WD Wraiths reaction

[akiro27]

So after reading the new White Dwarf ... once the happiness of seeing the Terrorgheist subsided, I noticed the new entries for the Wraiths. Following what's in WD, both the Cairn Wraiths & Banshee are now more expensive (by 10 & 20 points respectively) and are now Hero choices instead of Rares.

I'm a relatively new player and have only picked up White Dwarf a few times. Because of that, I'm not familiar with how rules introduced in WD play out. All the entries have an 'official rule' stamp next to them. Does this mean that Cairn Wraiths and Banshees are 100% hero choices now, or that we have the option to use them as either Heros or Rares?

Additionally, what do you guys think? I kinda like the idea of being able to toss a banshee/wraith in a unit of skellies to give them terror, or help with some attacks. Using them as a character is kinda cool in some aspects. However, my hero choices are usually pretty full up with necros/thralls/WKs. I've enjoyed using them as rares in the past.

What do you experienced VC players think?

-aki

 

[desfer]

First of all welcome to the forum :) if wraiths/banshees stop being rare choices i am gonna be really pissed!! Its my favorite unit and have many of them, how many wraith heroes am i going to use!!!! Since you have the magazine could you please check if there is anything that says that wraith hero can be bought as an upgrade?

 

[Sanai]

We can't really give you an answer until we have WDs ourselves. My advice would be to read every bit of the rules text. If it does not say they replace the rare choice it doesnt replace the rare choice, instead being additional to the rare choice.

 

[Grish]

From somehwere on the net:
(link: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/384939.page)


all these new rules are meant to be official rules.

The Ghoul king mount thing. It's worth some more points than a Varghulf. It can be included as a mount for a ghoul king (wich is any vampire lord with the ghoulkin vampiric power) or as a RARE UNIT.

It flies, causes terror, is large target, undead. I think it is WS3 or 5, not sure on that. S5, T6, W6, I3, A4, L??.

It has a shooting attack similar to the banshee. Roll 2d6 + number of wounds remaining of the monster - Leadership of the target unit = No armour saves allowed wounds. Not sure on the range. I think it was 18". Probably less.

Can be upgraded with poisoned attacks and/or a special rule that inflicts 3d6 S2 hits on any BtB unit when it dies.

The wraiths become a hero choice, and it seems they can join units. They are the same stats as in the VC book, and can make an special attack, replacing its normal attacks. This special attack auto-wounds and doesn't allow armour saves. The model is plastic and has 3 different heads. It's like levitating, with a cloak and a scythe.

The banshees become a hero choice (not sure if they can join units). Not new rules. The model is great. Also levitating.

It isn't specified if the wraiths rare unit of the VC book is still usable.

What I like: all, but the fact that they are giving us even less reasons to take anything but ghouls as basic units.

 

[Nexus]

What I like: all, but the fact that they are giving us even less reasons to take anything but ghouls as basic units.

Yup, I don't see why they couldn't have thrown in a simple "Skeleton Warriors are now 5pts per model" at the end as well...

Especially since Tomb Kings just got them.

 

[akiro27]

So there's no mention of optional in the rules block, however re-reading the introduction article, "The Dead and the Damned", it says "...for which Phil Kelly has written some new rules to include them as optional Hero choices."

So it sounds like you can still use them as rares, as written in the book, however you can pay more to have them as heroes and use them in ranks, or as lone characters. I wonder if that means the rare-choice version of the Cairn Wraith will also have 'Chill Grasp' or if that's strictly for the hero version.

-aki

 

[Grish]

Or if Hero level wraiths can use magic items... Flayed Hauberk would be nice on one. Also, you could field 5 across the front of a skeleton unit for a mere 300 pts...

 

[Normal]

Could they going to make both?

Wraith = hero
Banshee = hero
Cairn Wraith = rare
Tomb Banshee = rare (upgrade for Cairn Wraiths)

 

[Alucard]

Wraiths and Banshees are rares and heros. Got the WD today.

 

[Skarsnik the Lord]

First of all I have a question. Are the new Wraith and Banshee heroes 0-1 choices? I heard it somewhere but I'd like to hear the correct answer.

I don't understand the logic of GW... Of course it's good that GW is trying to turn WD into a hobby magazine again, but magic this kind of rules is a bit weird. Fortunately it seems like the Wraiths are still rare choice and the heroes are not OP or such. At least I'm glad they nerfed out the Power Scroll. :D But the main question is: Why GW does all this kind of stuff instead of rewriting the very old army books?

I'm pretty sure that the new Hero Wraiths and Banshees cannot take magic items. I mean, a Vampire with the Spectral Form power can't take any magic items, so why would a lousy Wraith get? ;) The Terrorgheist doesn't look too bad, but I'm not sure do I want a unit which can be blasted with a single cannonball...

All in all, the upgrade seems okay. Nerfing the Power Scroll is a very good thing, even though it was banned in many places/tournaments. A couple of new hero choices for Vampires... Nothing too special, they're quite expensive. Same goes with the Terrorgheist IMO. This kinds of small upgrades are okay as long as they don't bring anything OP in.

EDIT: Yay, I got the new White Dwarf! :D Yep, Wraiths and Banshees are 0-1 ans can still be taken as rare. Gotta love it.

- Cheers, Skarsnik. :thumbsup:

 

[Sanai]

Well adding these things in a WD gives us some more options while we wait for the new army book. It isnt instead of rewriting army books, its just those armybooks take alot of time to write, as well as all the models that go along with them. So while we wait, they mayaswell throw us a few bones.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

I like the changes, if they are in addition - will be getting my WD this Sat. It adds a bit of variety, though are there any limitations on putting them in non-ethereal units and can they have magical equipment?

 

[Skarsnik the Lord]

I re-read the text in the new White Dwarf and start thinking about a question... Are the new hero Wraiths and Banshees always 0-1 or just in the Pact list in Storm of Magic?

- Cheers, Skarsnik. :thumbsup:

 

[akiro27]

I like the changes, if they are in addition - will be getting my WD this Sat. It adds a bit of variety, though are there any limitations on putting them in non-ethereal units and can they have magical equipment?

There were a few pictures showing wraiths/banshees in units of core. It appeared to me that they could join - a little help causing terror could be nice for skeletons & ghouls. Didn't see anything about magic items.

I re-read the text in the new White Dwarf and start thinking about a question... Are the new hero Wraiths and Banshees always 0-1 or just in the Pact list in Storm of Magic?

The magazine isn't in front of me, but I took that to be SoM pact specific.

-aki

 

[Count Lasombra]

I for one am glad to be able to field individual banshees again.I hated having to buy a whole unit and champ upgrade just to access the banshee's scream.

 

[Vorizah Vukotic]

Yes I agree having an individual banshee is a great thing and I'm thrilled were seeing a return of wraith hero's however are they allowed magic items? etc.... although where the points are gunna come from to fit one in a standard 2K list iknow not. not so thrilled about the new big monster tho think it's just GW attempt to sell high profit items by making them amazing in the game so everyone must have one to or lose kinda thing...

 

[Eric Northman]

It is nice to hear that banshees ar a hero choice now but I realy wonder how oficial this upgrades are going to be. Will tournaments alow you to use it? If they do it will be great if they don't i'm not even going to bother buying and painting the moddels

Eric

 

[Sanai]

I dont think the Terrorgeist is like that at all, it isnt terribly powerful for its points cost. Its viable, but I doubt its a "amazing in game so everyone has to use it or lose" monster at all. VC were able to win games before the terrorgeist and will continue to do so with or without it.

 

[Zephyr]

I must say I like what I hear so far, I might actually dust off my VC army before the next army book.:)

 

[CoOp3000]

I dont think the Terrorgeist is like that at all, it isnt terribly powerful for its points cost. Its viable, but I doubt its a "amazing in game so everyone has to use it or lose" monster at all. VC were able to win games before the terrorgeist and will continue to do so with or without it.

I like the fact that it isn't a "Take this and win" monster, though.

It gives us options, which is good.
Unfortunately, it's in rare, where we already have pretty good stuff.
In my opinion, we need new rare choices so one doesn't HAVE to take gg to be competitive.

 

[Uncle Fester]

I don't know why GW has to make things so vague...

It looks like you can have Wraith/Banshee Heroes and (or?) Wraith/Banshee Rares (it would have been nice if they said "...in addition to..."). It is pretty clear that the 0-1 is for the Storm of Magic "Pact lists".

Do all Wraiths get the Chill Grasp attack (including the Wraith on the Black Coach)?

Are the adjusted point counts for the Hero choices only (I think so, but who knows)?

Fester

 

[BloodKnight]

I don't know why GW has to make things so vague...

It looks like you can have Wraith/Banshee Heroes and (or?) Wraith/Banshee Rares (it would have been nice if they said "...in addition to..."). It is pretty clear that the 0-1 is for the Storm of Magic "Pact lists".

Do all Wraiths get the Chill Grasp attack (including the Wraith on the Black Coach)?

Are the adjusted point counts for the Hero choices only (I think so, but who knows)?

Fester

"Cairn Wraiths [Tomb Banshees] are HERO choices in a Vampire County Book
,
and 0-1 can be included in a Pact with the Dreaded Vampire Counts of Sylvania."

It doesn't seem ambiguous to me at all once it is read it with the
insert -------> BIG A$$ COMMA

1. They are Hero choices only. No where does it mention them being also a Rare choice.
2. Only Cairn Wraith Hero has the Chill Grasp attack. It's not in the official FAQs so no one else gets it.
3. They are only 0-1 choices when using the Pact with the Dreaded, which means other armies can only take one Cairn Wraith. There is no limit to the Vampire Counts codex (except 25%).[/size]

 

[artisturn]

on the pages for the new Wraith and Banshee models it shows the stats for the units and the characters both.

So that should confirm that they are both an unit and hero choice.


And I am pretty excited that they are hero choices again , I wonder what other great stuff from the past is going to return to our army.

 

[Guillius]

on the pages for the new Wraith and Banshee models it shows the stats for the units and the characters both.

So that should confirm that they are both an unit and hero choice.


And I am pretty excited that they are hero choices again , I wonder what other great stuff from the past is going to return to our army.

Indeed I went to the GW website as if to Order/Advance Order the new wraith models and it says you can make a Wraith and a Wraith (character) out of the kit which seems to strongly indicate that they are still both as artisturn has said.

 

[Bishop]

I would say that this link makes it conclusive that Wraiths/Banshees can be taken both/either way!

It also shows the new "special" rule(s) for the "character" types only.