Basing conundrum referencing the old world

[McDougall Designs]

Hey everyone,

With release of the Old world by Games workshop coming up, I wanted to get started on a tune Kings Army.

From what I understand, Games workshop has not released a basing chart yet. The supposition is that standard infantry will be on 25 mm squares.

How likely do you think skeleton warriors and such will be on 25 mm squares? I'm somewhat apprehensive about basing models and then potentially having to change their bases at the last minute.

 

[Sception]

Unfortunately I do think you have to hold off for the moment, because we just don't have confirmed base sizes, other than old 20mm square bases are now supposed to be on 25mm squares. "most" 25mm square and 25mm x 50mm base units are also going to larger base sizes, but no specifics.

That info is from april this year - link - which is new enough that it's unlikely to have changed, but old enough that it ~might~ have.

TBH I would hold off on prep work for a TOW army until we get finalized base size charts, but those might not arrive until the actual game does. I don't think official round base sizes for AoS were published until the game was released then either.

But if you must get a head start in on prep work, then the safest stuff right now is Skeleton Warriors, Skeleton Archers, and Tomb Guard, all of which should be on 25mm squares according to the info from April.

Infantry heroes - Tomb Kings & Princes, Liche Priest, Necrotect, herald - are also ~probably~ on 25mm squares to be able to rank up with the infantry units, and the new infantry kings we've seen look like they're on 25mm squares to me, but it's hard to say with new models, and I don't think we've seen any heroes actually joined up in units in any of the promotional pictures for TOW. Joining units might not be an actual mechanic in the game, in which case the base size of heroes might be different from their squads.

For those who want to avoid rebasing existing armies, or who want to maintain cross-game functionality with either Oldhammer or Age of Sigmar (but probably not both at the same time), spaced unit trays are an option worth considering.

LITKO sells laser-cut plywood trays that will convert both 20mm square to exactly 25mm square ("compatible with Oathmark") or 25mm round to ~roughly~ 25mm square (a bit extra rim space, as one would expect for a unit tray built for actual 25mm square bases). The 20mm square to 25mm square trays currently max out at 5x4, but I expect more sizes to become available after TOW releases, as there will likely be a demand for larger trays, particularly 5x5 and 6x5 or even 6x6 for hoardy anvils & chaffy tarpits, or wider than 5 frontage for offensive glass cannon units.

Coveted Forge sells 3d printed plastic trays, again both for 20mm square to 25mm square and 25mm round to 25mm square, customizeable with a wide variety of sizes and with divets for magnets if you're into that.

If you have a 3d printer it shouldn't be too hard to find files for printing your own unit tray spacers.

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If you want to maintain compatibility with all 3 games at the same time, that'll be difficult, My initial thought would be to go baseless entirely, and pin some wire pegs out the bottom of your models' feet. You can then do different bases or unit trays for each game with holes drilled in to attach the pins to. This would be difficult with skeletons, but maybe not impossible. This or something like it might be the only viable option for AoS/ToW cross play for larger models like chariots and monsters, where you probably won't be able to fit the entire dimensions of their old world square base into their AoS circle or oval base or vice versa.

 

[Sception]

Important base size update!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/12/11/old-world-almanack-living-saints-and-special-rules/

Brett knights of the realm are on 30mm x 60mm bases.

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Extrapolation / Speculation (not confirmed, don't rely on for rebasing yet):

in the old days the most common base sizes were smaller infantry (20mm square), larger infantry (25mm square) and standard cavalry, which were meant to be 25mm x 50mm (ie two of the larger infantry bases) but in practice varried to a degree that frankly shouldn't have been acceptable even back then.

We have previously been told that the smallest base size in TOW will be 25mm square. If standard cavalry is now 30mm x 60mm then it's likely there's a new 30mm square base size for larger infantry, the stuff that previously was on 25mm squares, the equivalent of like the 32mm rounds used in 40k and AoS.

There were also smaller and larger monster / monstrous infantry square bases which were 40mm square and 50mm square respectively (ie 4x the small infantry base and 4x the large infantry base). If these scale up in proportion, then stuff that used to be on 40mm squares will now be on 50mm squares, while stuff that used to be on 50mm squares will now be on 60mm squares.

An open question is whether all cavalry will still be on a shared base size, in which case they'll all be 30mm x 60mm, or whether there will now be smaller and larger cav in TOW the way there are in AoS. It's possible that lighter cav like skeleton horsemen will still be on 25x50s, but imo it's more likely that all cav will be on the new 30x60s.

Particularly relevant to Tomb Kings are chariot bases, which in the past were used for our chariots, necroknights, stalkers, and sphinxes. chariot bases used to be 50x100mm rectangles. If all cavalry do get converted to 30x60s then chariot bases will likely go to 60x120.

 

[Raven Torrid]

New info from GW regarding base sizes:

 

[Sception]

Boo. I want to be able to play when the game comes out. That means knowing the base sizes beforehand so I can prepare.

 

[McDougall Designs]

agreed. This is bubkis.

 

[Sception]

New info: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/12/31/sunday-preview-prepare-to-enter-the-world-of-legend/

Supposedly these are all of the official base sizes:

Based on observation of pictures and/or previously confirmed sizes, I'm fairly confident about the following base sizes:

25mm square: Skeleton Warriors, Skeleton Archers, Tomb Guard, Infantry Heroes

40mm square: Ushabti, Bowshabti

25 x 50mm rectangle: Skeleton Horsemen, Horse Archers, Heroes mounted on Skeletal Steeds

50mm x 100mm rectangle: Skeleton Chariots, Sepulchral Stalkers, Necropolis Knights, Heroes mounted on Chariots (but not Settra)

100mm x 150mm rectangle: Settra, Bone Dragon


Confirmed models with bases I'm not sure about:

the Sphinxes: I think they're on the slightly wider new 60mm x 100mm rectangle, but they might still be on the old 50 x 100.

Tomb Swarms: I think they're on 40mm squares, like the old ones, but they're new models and I haven't seen them next to anything else to compare sizes, so it's possible they could be on 50mm squares now.

Screaming Skull Catapult: Iirc this was confirmed to be returning (in resin, boo). This will probably be separate bases for the war machine and crew, with the crew on 25mm squares and the catapult on either a 50x100 or 60x100 rectangle, but that's just guesswork.

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Then there's completely unknown units - units which, as far as I'm aware, haven't been shown in any official TOW photographs. These may or may not be returning at all, but I will speculate.

Nagash: likelyhood of returning - nill. He's not active at the time TOW is set, certainly not in the areas the game is set. If he is somehow playable, he'll be on the 100mm x 150mm rectangle base he was originally sold with.

Arkhan: likelyhood of returning - nil. The AOS model is on the wrong mount for the time period, and there's no current official model for him on his period appropriate flying four-horse chariot, requiring conversions, which GW does not encourage anymore. If he were playable, he'd be on a 25mm square on foot or a 100mm x 150mm rectangle on his chariot, like Settra. Thankfully generic liche high priest on foot or on bone dragon should be reasonable rules proxies.

Casket of Souls: likelyhood of returning - mid. A couple days ago I would have said high chance of returning. I mean, it's iconic, right? You could hardly imagine the tomb kings without it, and yet... I don't think it's been confirmed? It's not on the list of stuff that will be available for preorder on saturday (though neither will the catapult, and iirc it was confirmed). More significantly thhough, what official base size would you even put it on? It's ever so slightly too wide for the 60mm x 100mm rectangle, yet it would be positively swimming in the wildly oversized 100mm x 150mm rectangle, which is the only size up. Aesthetically it wants to be on like an 80mm or 100mm square, but that's not an option. They could just tell you to run it baseless maybe, as it's vaguely rectangular already? I don't know.

Tomb Scorpion: likelyhood of returning: mid. I don't think I've seen it mentioned, and it's theoretically kind of redundant with the stalkers and the new swarms in terms of burried harassment unit? But it's kind of iconic. If they bring it back, it could be on the same 50mm square it used to be sold with, though the 50x75 would be a bietter fit. It's honestly slightly too wide for that, even, but it would be swimming in a 60x100.

Carrion: likelyhood of returning: mid. probably on 40mm squares if they do come back, but I suppose they could be bumped up to 50.

Bone Giant / necroligh colossus: likelyhood of returning: low. Terrible model, redundant with the much better plastic sphinxes, etc. If they bring back the old model then it will still be on its old 50mm square. That said, there were rumors of a fully designed and never released plastic colossus/heirotitan kit way back in the day. If those were true and there were a new model yet to be announced, then it could be on another base, maybe a 50x75 with a striding pose? Sadly, if they were releasing a new plastic bone giant kit I think we'd have seen it already, so it's probably the lousy old resin guy or nothing, with nothing as a real possibility.

Heirotitan: likelyhood of returning: extremely low. GW just doesn't publish rules for units that don't have official first party models anymore, so I would say the odds are nil. But there was that rumor way back when of a finished but unproduced new plastic colossus/heirotitan kit, so I guess there's some hope? Again, imo we'd have seen it already if it were happening. And if a new model did appear, there's no telling what base size it would be on.


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I think that's everything. Let me know if I left anything out.

 

[McDougall Designs]

indeed. Thank you.