Legion of Nagash LoN 8th Edition review - Magic

[Forge]

i didnt read all the posts here, but the 5+ spell is broken beyond belief.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Care to elaborate in what way?

Without reading through the information you are perhaps not understanding why this spell is present. The Legion use rituals and spells (previously agreed and voted through), and they are meant to be more magically powerful than other armies. This has tried to be balanced and reflected in the overall army synergy and points costs.

I don’t see the Rituals themselves as being broken, compared to many of the spells in the 8th they are a lot less powerful. They also are not necromancy spells, and a caster can only attempt to cast one Ritual per magic phase, even though he has access to all 4. It is therefore a very real possibility that no rituals will be cast though of course you can hedge your bets by going magic heavy.

Finally we have attempted to balance it would by removing the ability to Channel, and also make it so the Rituals require a roll to cast as in the 7th edition they were automatically cast as bound spells.

The only area I think they may be OP is the casting roll? You could potentially have the casting roll as 10 on a level 4 (more with magic items), which I could see as unfair. We could overcome this by the Rituals just having a static power level like the old bound spells?

 

[Pietr Von Carstein]

I think he was talking about the effects of whispering spirits being broken . But its not that bad really because a lot of armies have very few units with psychological benefits . It really only effects Daemons and Undead , and not everyone plays them .

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Really? o.o

Well in that case I entirely disgaree. When you see what some of the other spells can do in the 8th and their casting values I feel that spell is fine. It got voted through previously as well so I feel it does not need changing.

 

[Bishop]

The spell is powerful under the right circumstances. Perhaps it shouldn't be the signature spell... then you would be limited to a single use per magic phase.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Hmm, yes I agree with that.

Looking at the rule book Lores they have 7 spells, signature plus 6 spells. We are using the previous concept where all casters have 1 base spell (like IoN) plus the other spells, i.e the spell doesn't take up part of their spell allotment.

So it seems to me we either:

Turn Possession into a Signature spell, which in effect is a downgrade as they will know one less spell

or

We create another low level spell.

Thoughts?

 

[Pietr Von Carstein]

As we are bringing them in line with the rule book we should probably make possession the signature spell .

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Yes I agree. It would also balance out the combination of spells and rituals more I suppose.

 

[Bishop]

 

[The Dark Lord Mr Fluffy]

Whispering Spirits - Cast on 5+

Remains in Play. This is a hex spell that targets one of the enemy unit within 18". When successfully cast, this spell removes all psychological effects with the exception of stupidity, even if caused by magic items. This includes the army specific rules such as Cold Bloodied. The unit must also use its stat base Ld for all Ld tests and may not benefit from the Battle Standard.
Undead / DoC units affected by this spell must take psychology tests as normal. If failed instead of suffering the normal effects they will suffer a number of wounds equal what they failed the test by as per the rules for Instability/Crumbling. The wizard can choose to cast the spell at 12+, in which case the spell affects the target unit for the rest of the game. If the spell is successfully cast then it cannot be dispelled by any means.

I have to agree, this seems a tad much for a 5+, I'd say it should be at least a 7+. Seeing as you can turn your enemy's best unit into a terribly crappy unit who can't even use their BSB? The BSB is such a huge thing in the new edition for nearly every army. I just think this spell would end up making a game against the Legion a lot less fun.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Well that was actually voted through so I don't feel we are in a position to override a majority vote, unless others feel there is just cause with the change in the rules from the 7th to the 8th?

 

[Pietr Von Carstein]

Maybe remove the BSB reference since they are quite important .

 

[The Dark Lord Mr Fluffy]

Agreed

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Ok, well with the change of the importance of a BSB in the 8th I can agree on that. Are there any other objections are can we class this list as finished?:

Magic of the Legion of Nagash

Rituals of Nagash

All casters in the Legion of Nagash know all four rituals, in addition other characters may know them in which case it will be specified in their profile. They replace the ability to channel extra PD as per the BRB, thus no casters in the Legion of Nagash may channel. They channel dispel dice as normal during the enemy magic phase.

To cast a ritual the wizard rolls D6 (not taken from the pool dice, in effect a “free” dice) and adds their magic level. On a roll of 5+ the Ritual is successfully cast at a power level equal to the total rolled. If the wizard fails the Ritual is simply not cast, though the wizard can still cast as normal for the remainder of the magic phase. A natural roll of 1 regardless of modifiers is always a failure. A wizard may choose to cast a Ritual at anypoint during the magic phase

The rules for irresistible force and miscasts do not apply to Rituals. In all other respects, Rituals are treated as normal spells. For example, they can be destroyed by enemy magic items, spells, etc. that destroy spells, which would affect the caster making him unable to use that Ritual for the rest of the game. All Rituals are augment spells.

Ritual of Birth
This ritual may be cast upon a single Undead unit within 12" of the caster. The targeted unit may raise / heal the following amount:
Core: D6 wounds (may take over original unit size)
Special: D3 wounds
Rare / Characters / Monster Mounts: 1 wound

Ritual of Life
This ritual may be cast upon a unit within 12" of the caster. The targeted unit may make a single march move. If this move takes them into base contact with an enemy unit it counts as a charge.

Ritual of Death
This ritual may be cast upon a unit within 12" of the caster. The targeted unit may re-roll all rolls to wound in combat until the next magic phase

Ritual of Afterlife
This ritual may be cast upon a unit within 12" of the caster. Any models struck down in the next combat phase may still make all its normal attacks, even though it is dead.

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The Lore of Nagash

To randomly generate a spell from the Lore of Nagash, roll a D6 and consult the chart below. All wizards automatically know Possession in addition to their normal number of spells.

Fear of the Dark Lord – Lore Attribute
The power of the Dark Lord is the driving force behind his legions, and this reminder is no more obvious when his potent magics cause chaos across the battlefield. When a Lore of Nagash spell is successfully cast, any friendly wizards within 12” that have a magic equal or lower to the caster are have their minds cleared as they see their Lords might. If they previously failed to cast a spell (and thus could not longer cast for the rest of this magic phase), that is now negated and they can continue to cast as normal, possibly failing to cast and being stopped from casting again. However there is no limit to how many times a wizard may have his mind “cleared” in a magic phase.

D6..Spell..................Casting Value

0 ....Possession......................................4+
1 ....Whispering Spirits............................5+
2 ....Visions of Doom...............................6+
3 ....Land of the Dead.............................7+
4 ....The True Gaze of Nagash..................9+
5 ....Curse of Reanimation.......................10+
6 ....The Great Awakening.......................12+​

Possession - Cast on 4+ (Signature Spell)
Through the eyes of his servants the Lord sees all and punishes those who defy his rightful might.
From the first book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 16, verses 11-12

This spell can be cast on any undead model within 18".
For the remainder of this magic phase the caster counts as been stood at the targets position for casting spells. If the caster suffers a miscast the target suffers the effects as if were the caster with the exception that if the result is to loose a magic level or spell, the caster looses that as normal. A more powerful version of this spell can be cast on 7+, which increases the range to 36”

Whispering Spirits - Cast on 5+
At His command the power of our Lord commands His immortal spirits, and they fill the thoughts of his foes with words fear and undermining. All who stand in their path are rendered powerless, such is the might of our Lord.
From the second book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 12, verses 4-6

Remains in Play. This is a hex spell that targets one of the enemy unit within 18". When successfully cast, this spell removes all psychological effects with the exception of stupidity, even if caused by magic items. This includes the army specific rules such as Cold Bloodied. The unit must also use its stat base Ld for all Ld tests and may not benefit from the Battle Standard.
Undead / DoC units affected by this spell must take psychology tests as normal. If failed instead of suffering the normal effects they will suffer a number of wounds equal what they failed the test by as per the rules for Instability/Crumbling. The wizard can choose to cast the spell at 12+, in which case the spell affects the target unit for the rest of the game. If the spell is successfully cast then it cannot be dispelled by any means.

Visions of Doom - Cast on 6+
The Lord of the Dead stretched out His hand towards His foes, and gifted them a vision of their demise. All who saw it quaked and fled, and the Lord was pleased.
From the second book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 5, verses 17-18

This spell can be cast on any point within 24" that is within the wizard's line of sight. Once cast, all units within D6" of that point must take an immediate (unmodified) ld test or flee away from the spot.

Land of the Dead - Cast on 7+
Who dares stand against Him, when the spirits of the land conspire to keep His foe at bay?
From the first book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 8, verses 9-10

Land of the Dead is a hex spell that targets one enemy unit within 24". Once cast, the enemy unit halves any movement it makes (including flying movement or fleeing) is halved until the start of the casting player's next turn. The wizard can choose the more powerful version which reduces the target’s movement to one quarter (rounding up), in addition they cannot make any reform movements, even the free reform granted by the presence of a musician. The upgraded version has a casting value of 14+

The True Gaze of Nagash - Cast on 9+
His gaze fell upon them, and He judged them. Dammed in His sight, their flesh abandoned them, and they became dust.
From the fifth book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 9, verses 6-8

This is a magic missile with a range of 24", If successfully cast, the Gaze of Nagash hits its target and causes 2D6 Strength 5 hits. A powered up version can be cast at 16+ with a range of 36” causing 3D6 Strength 5 hits

Curse of Reanimation - Cast on 10+
Pity the fool who comes against our Lord, for their souls are forfeit and their lives His for the taking.
From the third book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 3, verses 12-14

The Curse of Reanimation may be cast on any one unengaged enemy unit within 24".
If successfully cast, it causes D6+4 Strength 4 hits, with no armour save allowed. Any models killed by this spell are immediately raised as zombies and placed in BtB in front of the affected unit. They are ranked up as per the normal BRB.
In the following combat phase they count as charging, and any Ld or break tests the affected unit has to take for the remainder of this turn are at -1Ld. (Due to the unnerving nature of their comrades attacking them).From this point on the zombies are classed as a normal unit worth 25VP
Alternatively the wizard can cast the powered up version on 20+. Instead of zombies the raised models will be Pinnacle Guard with basic equip as per their army book entry. The raised unit of Pinnacle Guard will instead be worth 100VP.

The Great Awakening - Casting Value - 14+
At His command the dead will rise. Those thought broken will be whole, and even those who fought Him in life will be welcomed in death.
From the fifth book of the Cult of Nagash, Chapter 7, verses 7-9

Once this augment spell is cast, every undead unit you control within 24" automatically regains the following number of wounds:
Core - D6+3
Special - D6
Rare - D3
Characters (not in units) - D3

In the case of core units, this can create additional models above the number the unit started with, whereas in the case of special and rare units it can only bring the unit back to full strength.
This can also heal undead characters as noted above, though it will not work if they are specifically within a unit unless there are excess 'healed wounds' to be passed on, in which case they can only a maximum of 3 wounds may be passed on. In the case of mounts, roll D3 each for the character and the mount.
The range of this spell can be extended to 36” on a casting value of 21+

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[Pietr Von Carstein]

Seems fine to me .

 

[Capt Rubber Ducky]

Yeap, looks good to me.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

Ok, so do we think it needs to go to the vote again? I am unsure as the basic premise hasn't changed, just adapted to fit with the 8th edition.

Any one thing we should vote on this, or should be instead move onto the next topic?

 

[Bishop]

I'd say that the changes should still be voted through... we are proposing new rules/rules changes. Though, you might need to make announcements in order to get enough people involved in the polls.

(Same applies to any Bloodline changes )