2250pt list and tactical questions

[Fujin]

Any feedback and discussion on this will be most welcome.


One of the keys to this list is understanding that unit command models (e.g. Champions, Standard Bearers, Musicians) displace characters to the second rank of a unit. So if I have 4 characters in a unit that has full command, two of them must be displaced (assuming the unit is running 5-wide). Okay?

Next key is understanding (or making sure I understand!) how BSBs work. A BSB does not have to be in the front rank to award the point of combat resolution that comes from having a battle standard in the unit. Nor does it prevent any magical effects from occuring. Okay? (seriously is that ok? - is that right or have I misread the rule?!).

On that premise - how would this work...


Lord - Red Fury, Infinite Hatred, Walking Death, Carstein Ring (FAQ'd to bring him back fom anything), Sword of Battle (could go Sword of Might actually), Charmed Shield (ignore first hit on a 2+)

Wight King - BSB, Drakenhof Banner

Wight King -Glittering Scales (-1 to hit), Gem of Blood (now rebounding Killing Blow!)

Wight King - Nightshroud, Sword of Kings

Necromancer - Dispel Scroll, Van Hel's Danse Macabre


68 Skeletons - Champion, Standard Bearer, Banner of Endless Nightmare

Corpse Cart

Corpse Cart


Varghulf

Varghulf

Black Coach of Awesome



Satisfies all the percentage caps (the Heroes fit... just!).

The characters pile into the Skeleton unit with the BSB and Necro both being forced into the second rank. Two shots at ASF from the Carts (assuming I have power dice after the Coach has finished o_o) and 3 shots at ASF when I'm in combat (Carts and Necro with Danse).

Everything else can march (everything else being twin-linked Varghulfs and the Coach... sorry, Coach of Awesome) so would likely go on the flanks.

The front rank of the Skeleton unit is death on a stick - multiple 3 wound characters at toughness 5; multiple options to accept challenges; a Vampire Lord just aching to demolish rank and file (or at str6 maybe a softish non-ASF character in a challenge) - also a Vampire Lord most likely to come back to life when (if) he gets smushed. Would maybe consider reworking the third Wight King to have the Cursed Book and Sword of Anti-Heroes (instead of Shroud/SoK combo).


Thoughts? This is a big step for me - I'm not usually thinking anything less than 10-12 deployments.

 

[uga bug]

Well that is one biig unit of skeles!
I'd think that to run it only 5 wide is a waste- thats what 12 ranks?
I also dont understand why you'd want to have your characters hiding in the second rank, i understand it may be for protection, but i think the skele unit should make use of the horde rule. Its certainly big enog to do so!

Also having a unit 5 wide and 12 deep is gonig to be very difficult to manevuer, and with so few units for your opponent to choose from I'd imagine flank charges would be an issue for your force. The Varghulfs may be able to hold fof skirmishing units on your flanks but they won't stand up to a fully ranked unit!

possibly drop a corpse cart and varghulf and add in a smaller unit of skeles or ghouls, to help secure the flanks of your monster skele unit!

 

[Bishop]

Yeah, I'm confused too. You want all those nice KB attacks at the front!

If you are going to field a unit that big, it might as well be in horde formation. I'd give the unit Spears too... allowing you to fight in 4 ranks!

I'd personally drop the Banner of Endless Nightmare and maybe pick up something like the Banner of Hellfire... oh fun! :tongue: If you need the +1 CR, you've clearly done something VERY wrong!

 

[Fujin]

Cheers for the feedback guys. After another read of the rules I discovered that characters can bounce themselves into combat if they miss out on being engaged - excellent! So a fat horde unit of Skellies (with spears?) and a line of tough choppy characters in the front is looking very appealing.

Biggest concern is keeping the Necro and BSB alive.

Also looking at dropping a Varghulf for some Spirit Hosts - not particularly effective I know but great fun and I have some neat models to represent them.

 

[Fodderboy]

Not sure of the rules for the One Ring, but can you join the front rank of any infantry unit, or does it have to be not in combat?

Instead of the shield, I'd consider the Dragon Helm for 2+ ward vs flaming attacks of any flavour. Challenge a BT and laugh.

I'd keep Walking Death. On the off chance the unit doesn't break, you want as much CR in your favour to prevent the Combat Reform. Unless you wanted to cause Terror instead.

The only problems I really see for you are:
1 - Massed artillery & gunlines. Against this, I'd bait & flee so that you were lined up with a cannon or two, then shoot out metric craploads right down the line, and , Templates are going to be guaranteed to hit. That's assuming I was playing Beardy /Empire Cheeze, instead of being a good VC boy.

2 - Spells that hit every model like Papa loves Nurglings and Flames of the Phoenix will be devastating.

3 - Hellpit Abominations. No reason why you shouldn't be up against two of them in the new era.

IIRC, if you've got a little drummer boy, you can pass a Ld check to reform after moving (I think after overruns and suchlike). I'd consider sacrificing a skelly (hard to do) for the added manoevering option, as those are the kinds of dirty tricks I know you like to run with. This does put two WK's in the second rank and another skelly in the front, so I am not sure if it's a worthwhile tradeoff. Trade a WK for a necro with Staff of Damnation?

I'd not worry about hordeing up. All you're doing is offering more juicy targets and combat rez. Skellies don't kill things, they stand there and get pulverized unless they're buffed, and you aren't geared for that. 16 ranks means that no unit will possibly be Steadfast against you. Let the skellies cower as much as they can behind the characters and flick spare parts and insults over their shoulders.

You've got an awesome option here for the mother-of-all non-screaming bell unit fillers...

Lastly, unless my math is a tad off, you're roughly 35 points short. I guess you'll need to paint a couple more. At least it's not V's Zombie Horde of points denial.

Hopefully I'll see you at CG on Sunday.