2500 Rapid (rabid) Attack Force

[Count Magpyr]

I have played WFB for ages, usually with one of the elven breeds. After a longish gap I am now looking to start a new army and have fallen for the charms of the Vampire Counts.
I always like to get my army sorted on paper before taking out my debit card and have been slowly evolving a VC army that is, I hope, suprisingly fast. My choices include units that can move a minimum of 8 or fly or are vampiric (march move). I also have to like the figures; I know from bitter experience that if I buy figures I don't like, I end up never painting them and never using them, even though they are the "sensible" choice.
If it is OK with the MODs I would like to just post my unit choices at this stage and leave the fine tuning of my Lords\Heroes to a later post.
So here goes:
CORE
7 Dire Wolves inc Doom Wolf x 5
8 Dire Wolves inc Doom Wolf x 4
SPECIAL
8 Black Knight inc full command, barding & screaming banner
5 Vargheists
RARE
Varghulf x 2
Terrorgheist
There are 3 Vamps with the BK; a Lord(Level 4) and 2 Heroes.

I am considering dropping one Varghulf and building up the Vargheists to 2 units of 4, instead. I really like the Blood Knights, but that ends up making the army very small, the vamps swallow up enough points as it is and so I have gone for a more monstrous approach.

The idea is to use the wolves as blockers\re-directors\traps etc, as well as allowing me to place my heavier units last in the set-up. I will be tending towards a refused flank, but a lot will depend on how my opponent sets up.

So what do you think sages of the crypt? You have all the experience of the ages, what do you think of the above.

Many thanks,

Count Magpyr

 

[The Sun King]

Welcome to the forum young fangling! Hope you'll enjoy your stay here!

Two major points about your army composition:
1. All DW core is not good since you need stuff to Anvil with. Zombs are better at this and Ghouls are pretty awesome offensively.
2. You have far too few BK's to make a safe bunker for you mounted lord. You should go 12+ at least.

Hope this helps!

And YAY! this was my post number 1.000!

 

[Count Magpyr]

Welcome to the forum young fangling! Hope you'll enjoy your stay here!

Two major points about your army composition:
1. All DW core is not good since you need stuff to Anvil with. Zombs are better at this and Ghouls are pretty awesome offensively.
2. You have far too few BK's to make a safe bunker for you mounted lord. You should go 12+ at least.

Hope this helps!

And YAY! this was my post number 1.000!

Hey, thanks for the comments.

i agree that 8 did seem too few BK, I will look at upping this. I will probably drop one of the Varghulfs and use the points from that.

Do I really need a core anvil? It would have to be ghouls, but they are not going to get there in time. Ideally I want to be in combat & possibly rolling up a flank by turn 2. The anvil is going to be a largely unused point sink, struggling to keep up.

Cheers.

 

[Lord Valleria Arthieris]

Have you thought about getting a coven throne orr run two mortis engines? Just with the two ME's you're looking at a plus 4 to cast thanks to blasphemous tome and if you have a lvl 4 wizard that's plus 8 on the cast and even better if that lvl 4 is in the throne the enemy has to past a leadership test with one d6 to try and hit you bolstered even more if you give that Vamp Lord on the throne begui le and AoDM. But again this is all in my own opinion.

 

[Mr MountainEater]

Have you thought about getting a coven throne orr run two mortis engines? Just with the two ME's you're looking at a plus 4 to cast thanks to blasphemous tome and if you have a lvl 4 wizard that's plus 8 on the cast and even better if that lvl 4 is in the throne the enemy has to past a leadership test with one d6 to try and hit you bolstered even more if you give that Vamp Lord on the throne begui le and AoDM. But again this is all in my own opinion.

i thought that the blasphomous tome couldn't be stacked? i might be wrong though.

 

[The Sun King]

It cannot be stacked.

 

[BloodbathMcGrath]

You could run skeletons with banner of swiftness? HW + shield boys can hold strong for a few turns; though they would still fall far behind a BK bus headed by a Lord...unless you ran the lord with the anvil...2 vamps in the bus and the lord marching anvil forward? The BK's would be moving slower than marching skeletons (with +1 movement) at that point though, which seems kinda odd.

 

[Count Magpyr]

Thanks for the comments so far.

I agree that the Coven Throne and Mortis Engine look glorious and I do have a small conversion idea floating around in the back of my mind with the Throne. Unfortunately I just can't believe how few figures you get with the sort of VC army I am looking at. I don't see how I can fit in a Throne. At over 200 pts it is more than one of my current vamp heroes. I would have to leave the L4 with the BK and put the remaining vamp on the Throne. Has anyone used a Throne regularly? How useful was it?

The skels + banner of swiftness + Gen was a cunning plan. As you say though, they would then be faster than the BKs. What if I dropped the BKs and replaced them with 6 Blood Knights, they can still march. Would 6 Blood Kts + Vamp Hero be an adequate hammer? Surely skels + Gen is a rather fragile anvil? Would ghouls suit this role better?

I have also been playing around with the ideas of Hexwraiths, but I still keep drifting back to my idea of a BK + 3 Vamp bus, supported by Terrorgheist and Vargheist with a rabid doggy screen and wild card Varghulf.

I am quite attracted to the Throne though......

 

[BloodbathMcGrath]

If your scraping for heroes/lords points, avoid the Throne and ZD because they will just sap up all the points you were trying to budget. Skeletons are decent anvils, they can hold up in combat, get healed, and throw a few punches- better so if they get buffed. Ghouls would be the fighty core you may be looking for, they will take down units on their own and if buffed can really throw down. Blood Knights aren't a bad idea if you want cavalry marching on flanks, also Varghulfs and vargheists come to mind, which you also thought of

DWs as all core could be a throw, because they can be destroyed in one turn by shooting, or after one round of combat. But you were thinking of running 9 units of wolves? I could see those units tying people up for a turn or two, but after they are all dealt with, you have NO CORE, so then it's just small units of hard-hitters. Now, if you move the wolves around right, charge at the right time, and get your hammer units set up to kill the prime targets; you may not need core after mid game. Given, zombies bleed CR and if you flank charge with knights, they can still end up crumbling from dead zombies. From there, skeletons bleed less and ghouls even less so that is the hierarchy of our infantry core. With wolves, you can block charges at knights and pick battles, but they don't last very long, so you have to work fast!!

 

[Count Magpyr]

Thanks for the ideas Bloodbath. I am hoping that I will be fast enough and focused enough to be able to deliver a fast, precise attack before the dogs are all gone. The zombies and skellies don't inspire me, while the ghouls seem to call out for a ghoul king and a totally different approach to the one I am currently developing.

This is where I am at the moment:

9 units of dogs (626 points- no fat here)

13 fully equipped BK with the Screaming Banner (I could drop this for the swift banner, but then I might be too fast to deliver coordinated attacks)

With the BK are;

General, Lvl 4, HA, BNM, QB, RF, OTS, Ogre Blade, Charmed Sh.
Wight King, Enchen Sh, BSS, Obsidian Amulet, Lance.

The Coven Throne (I couldn't resist, it is such a great figure)with
Hero, Lvl 1, BSB, Dispell Scroll,ADM, Beguile, Nightshroud, HA, Addit Hand Wpn. (I find the idea of an 18" BSB very appealing)

4 Vargheists inc Vargoyle. (I could lose a Vargheist & go Lvl 2 with the hero- Death Magic?)

Terrorgheist.

Now I accept I won't win every battle, but will this set up give opponents a pause for thought and a good fight?[/color]

 

[BloodbathMcGrath]

Well I see you have a staggering 13 drops, so you should be able to drop your best stuff right where you want it. I might suggest banner of barrows for BKs cause it's the tits (better hit avg). Now about that throne, hmmmmm. AoDM and Beguile could keep the hits down against it in combat plus boost it's innate psych battle ability, but against warmachines it could be in trouble, I guess VGs, TG and a sh*tload of wolves will have to tie up shooters asap! It sounds like a fun list, fast paced and menacing

 

[Count Magpyr]

Cheers Bloodbath, thanks for your thoughts. The comments "fun list, fast paced and menacing" are just what I was wanting to hear.

Now I am down to one Vamp in the BK, the banner banner is a much better buy.

I'll be off hunting down those figures now, what's the betting I leave the Dire Wolves till last?

 

[BloodbathMcGrath]

Before buying, try a proxy battle with some friends. You have the rulebooks, but if the army build is unsuccessful, you'll have to buy even more stuff to make it balanced. I'd say buy the core and heroes cause you will use those regardless, same with the knights; but for the throne and all the wolves, use some proxies and see how they work after a few games. Good luck!