3000 Point VC vs High Elves (revenge!!!)

[Regis Von Carstein]

I played a 2v1 match up today, my 1500 VC & 1500 Beastmen vs 3000 Highelves.

We got tabled. 4 RP, 2 units of L. Seaguard, 2 units of archers, 1 unit of Miadens (BS5 strength 4 magic arrows), Frost Phoenix, Level 4 archmage, dragon mage on sun dragon + 2 fighting units.

We got shot to pieces. I was holding my own but my Beastmen ally was almost gone by turn 2.

Anyway, I challenged the High Elves buddy to a 1v1 3000pt match up. Here is my list. I expect to face a similar list as my buddy is not very inventive and he seems unstoppable with his current setup.


Lords:
Vampire Lord - Level 4 - barded nightmare, dragon helm, shield, heavy armor, ogre blade, talisman of perseverance, ironcurse icon, red fury

Hereos
Necromancer - Level 2, dispell scroll
Banshee
Vampire - Level 2, Forbidden Lore (Heavens), glittering scales, extra hand weapon

Core
44 ghouls + ghast (horde)
40 skeletons + command
5 dire wolves
5 dire wolves

Special
14 Black Knights + command + banner of barrows
8 crypt horrors + haunter
3 Vargheists
2 Fell bats

Rare
Varghulf
Terrorgheist

Total = 2,999

Thoughts?

 

[Banat]

Heavens is interesting. To mitigate his shooting and attack his dragon for extant attribute damage right?

 

[Seneschal]

Drop the banshee and give the vamp hero some protection. Glittering Scales doesn't offer all that much.
30 skellies fold easily. Drop some ghouls to get them to 40.
Split the wolves for more drops.
I'd drop the 'ghulf and switch Barrows for Swiftness to get another TG.

 

[Banat]

40skellies and 10dire wolves won't meet the core tax requirement.

 

[Seneschal]

What I said was drop some ghouls to get more skeletons, not all the ghouls. Keep what's left over after the skellie block reaches 40 models strong.

 

[Regis Von Carstein]

Good points about the skellies. 30 isn't enough. I'll bump them to 40. I'll also split the dire wolves into 2 units.

You don't think the banshee will be useful? The nice thing about her is she can protect my rear from dragons. What tends to happen is I push my whole army forward in an attempt to get to his gunline, and then the dragon/phoneix jump behind my lines.

I figured the banshee would be a deterent because one good scream good seriously damage them.

I kind of thought the -1 to hit was good enough as far as protection goes. I guess I could give him enchanged shield and heavy armor for a 3+/6++ save. That's really as good as it gets for a baby-vamp on foot. I could give him fear incarnate also, give the skellies screaming banner and put him in the skellies. That way I'll have 2 good infantry units.

I like the idea of banner of swiftness for BKs.

The one advantage that the Varghulf has over the TG that is often underestimated is his ability to march. He can be on a flank all alone and get to his prey fast. This is something I fear I would regret not having. That and the fact I don't have a second TG. I guess I could proxy a second TG for this game (we always allow proxies the first time you want to use anything, but only once).

I just thought of something. If I put my VL on a Hellsteed, can he still join the BK? Both Hellsteed and Nightmares are war beasts. That way I can move him with BK bus first turn. and charge a RBT on turn 2.

I like Heavens and as a VC player I very rarely get to use it so I thought I would try it out

 

[Regis Von Carstein]

I still have 50 pts. for Vampire powers for my VL. I did not give him the standard QB because I find that against elves, I don't really need it since if we both have it, we dice off and if has GW, (Lions and SM), I strike first anyway. Any ideas of what I could add for him?

 

[Banat]

Aura of Darkness and Beguile could be a nice complement to Red Fury if you're not fussed on QB.

 

[GhoulKing505]

Since you are facing elves I'd take the sword of strife over the ogre blade. You already wound most things on twos. Switch the banner of the barrows on your knights to the razor standard. This gives your vamp lord 7 attacks that are -3 to armour. It works for me. I like the extra attacks better due to red fury. The possibility of doing fourteen wounds is too good for me to pass up.

That's what I normally do. I feel it would be especially effective against elves. The razor standard will also allow your knights to do well in case they get stuck in combat longer than one round or if they get charged.

Double terrorgheist is a good idea as well. Although it is a little cheesy. Especially if combined with your blender lord.

 

[Regis Von Carstein]

Sword of strife vs Elves is good idea but what about Phoenix and dragons? I will struggle against those. I will probably not take double TG as it is kind of cheesy and I don't have a second TG.

So, If I give my lord SoStrife, how do I kill the monsters?

 

[Banat]

Should you get Wind Blast on your Forbiddon Lore... don't auto discard for the signature... Potentially with wind blast you could push your opponents dragon off the board. Dragons have BIIIIIIIG footprints. As soon as part of his base hits the edge of the board, it's off, and if it was the result of Wind Blast, it's lost as a casualty. You don't have to even inflict any hits or wounds.

Phoenix, Urannon's Thunderbolt.

Iceshard Blizzard reduces leadership by one, Aura of Darkness would reduce it by a further 1, then you could have a go at screaming some wounds off it.

 

[Regis Von Carstein]

Pushing units off the board.... I never thought of that. Are you sure that is how it is played? Just because when I use it I KNOW my opponent will complain. he does tend to leave some of his units at the board egde, can you point me to a rule in the Rulebook that states that units "forced" over the table edge are dead?

Urannon's Thunderbolt is a spell I hope to get because he will be very afraid of it, which will mean he will dispell it and my Lorv of Vamp spells will go off.

Iceshard Blizzard is pretty cool for that, I know.

 

[GhoulKing505]

Scream at those monsters. Seriously. It works. Or if you get hellish vigor just cast that on your bus. Between the vamp lord's seven attacks you should be able to finish off the phoenix. The dragon I'm not sure. When in doubt scream it out!

You could also tie the phoenix or dragon down with your crypt horrors. Should keep him stationary for a couple screams or a good flank charge set up. I don't know. Throw heavens spells at both as well. That'll help. There's a few options for to deal with monsters. The terrorgheist is probably your best bet though.

 

[Banat]

Hmmm I saw it mentioned as a tactic elsewhere although the source escaped me now. It seems most people treat the table edge as impassable terrain and as such the unit/monster would stop 1" from the edge. Oh well... pffft for that idea.

 

[heldantes]

I am playing 3k game against a High Elf player bringing super cheese (I've beaten him twice so far so he's going all out, which is fine, but scary).

How did your battle go?

My problem is his frost heart phoenix and his banner of world dragon which is why I don't give my vampires any magic weapons, even for an all comers.