cloud of flies

[Hanblack Nagash]

Its the wording of it that makes me curious.

"Deduct one from their rolls"

So i take it that whatever they roll it counts as one less so a 6 on the dice is actually a 5.

Does this mean that theoretically the dragon and rider cannot be poison attacked?

Or is the wording poor that its just a -1 hit penalty

Cheers

 

[bigbadbat]

This has since been faq'd.
Check the VC faq.

 

[The Sun King]

ERRATA
Page 49 – Zombie Dragon, Swarm of Flies.
Change this entry to read “Enemy models in base contact with
a Zombie Dragon deduct 1 from their rolls To Hit in close
combat”.

EDIT: See below for Lynks explanation.

 

[Lynks]

The answer lies not in cloud of flies but in the poisoned attacks rule.

"A model with the poisoned attacks special rule wounds his target automatically if his natural dice roll to hit is a 6."


So it doesn't matter whether or not you are giving them a -1, a 6 is still poisoned.

However, if you can apply enough modifiers so that the enemy is hitting on 7s then poison does not apply.


HOWEVER however, page 50 on rolling to hit in close combat states "sometimes modifiers apply to these rolls, but a natural dice score of 6 always hits and a natural dice score of 1 always misses"

So in CC you can't actually force an enemy to lose their poison unless you have a rule that specifically states so (which we don't)

 

[Hanblack Nagash]

Difference of oppinion i see

 

[The Sun King]

Lynks has the right of it, hadn't thought about the wording in the poison attacks rule.

 

[Bullhax]

I hadn't thought of the wording of poison either, right when I read the OP I thought the wording was intended to do just that.. But as 6's always hit and poison is worded the way it is, it just boils down to a strange wording of -1 to hit I guess..

 

[The Sun King]

Yeah, can't see why they should write it like that either... why not just say: Enemy models in base contact with the Zombie Dragon get -1 to hit. ?

 

[Lynks]

Yeah, can't see why they should write it like that either... why not just say: Enemy models in base contact with the Zombie Dragon get -1 to hit. ?

Because if you are going to be unbelievably brutally RAW the current wording you can follow this interpretation. :tongue: (never follow this interpretation)


“Enemy models in base contact with
a Zombie Dragon deduct 1 from their rolls To Hit in close
combat”

Page 50, ROLL TO HIT

"To determine whether or not hits are scored, roll a d6 for each attack a model gets to make."

That means each dice is a separate roll, meaning a character with multiple attacls makes multiple rolls to hit.

SO, Due to cloud of flies, you deduct 1 from these rolls to hit. you can interpret that as removing one dice rather than removing 1 from the value of each dice, 3 attacks just became 2. 1 attack became 0. In effect, you can interpret (or misinterpret in the strictest of RAW terms) that cloud of flies strips attacks.

This will make you no friends.

 

[Hanblack Nagash]

Yeah, can't see why they should write it like that either... why not just say: Enemy models in base contact with the Zombie Dragon get -1 to hit. ?

Because if you are going to be unbelievably brutally RAW the current wording you can follow this interpretation. :tongue: (never follow this interpretation)


“Enemy models in base contact with
a Zombie Dragon deduct 1 from their rolls To Hit in close
combat”

Page 50, ROLL TO HIT

"To determine whether or not hits are scored, roll a d6 for each attack a model gets to make."

That means each dice is a separate roll, meaning a character with multiple attacls makes multiple rolls to hit.

SO, Due to cloud of flies, you deduct 1 from these rolls to hit. you can interpret that as removing one dice rather than removing 1 from the value of each dice, 3 attacks just became 2. 1 attack became 0. In effect, you can interpret (or misinterpret in the strictest of RAW terms) that cloud of flies strips attacks.

This will make you no friends.

I know a rather large scrotum i might use that explanation on who is an absolute git whi would deserve it lol

 

[The Sun King]

LOL I love it Lynks!

 

[Rilth]

Just to Invocation of Nehek this thread, I've just noticed the Errata change to the rule and am wondering if it now makes a vampire with glittering scales invulnerable to lesser troops.
I mean the way I read it is as follows:

Enemies that require a 5+ to hit the vampire will be hitting on 6+ because of the penalty of the glittering scales.
Then because of cloud of flies any 6s they actually roll will become 5s and so not hit.

The poisoned attacks mentioned above will still work as a natural 6 counts before any deductions are made to hit.

Should I be reading it this way or should I view it like, they get -2 to each of their dice rolls to hit (so any 5s become 3s and any 6s become 4s), but if it was a natural 6 regardless it still hits?

 

[Thindol]

Regardless of modifiers a 6 always hits.

 

[Skittelz1981]

- natural 6 always hits. regardless of modifiers.
- poisoned attacks apply if a natural 6 is rolled, thus you cant modify it either.

Basically you should not see poisoned attacks as a 'to hit' roll. More like: when you roll to hit, all sixes automatically wound. This has nothing to do with -1 to hit on your rolls.


natural 6 always hit sucks imo. It should be just like shooting, where you can even have to hit on 8. thus in the case of the glittering scales+swarm of flies it would make for: if you roll a 6, you will need to roll that dice again and get a 4+ to actually hit. But thats just my opinion.
This doesnt mean that the combination of scales and swarm is obsolete, its just obsolete against low ws units