Finding weak opponents

[Kindred]

I'll be the first to admit it, I'm a terrible player. My paint and conversion jobs put most to shame, making me a shoe-in for such contests, but when it comes to actually playing the game i lose easily 90% of the time.
So my question is; does anyone have advice on finding god-awful players so i can have an even game? All my friends, even those new to the game, are waaaay better than me, and in any tournament i have proven to be a checkers-player among chess grandmasters. My brain just isn't built to process rules and strategies i guess, as earning my master degree with a 3.8 average has ruled out me being generally stupid.
So any ideas? How can I find a group of emotionally mature (read:not children) players who are also wrecks at this game and get a nice, competitive match?

 

[Johnny-Crass]

I would say just learn. No one likes getting their teeth kicked in ever game but that is how I learned and I would call my self a fairly decent player. Now if only I could learn to paint

 

[kevin.hopkins7]

It sounds like your 'friends' are not acting as such. I know some folks who r the same.
I saw them kick the crap out of some younger kids.

I wouldn't say getting your @$$ kicked is the only way to learn. You need a friendly experienced player to play a game and help you with every phase of the game during a whole battle.

The key to this is to play friendly games and not only in a tournament. You will get no mercy from anyone in a tourney.

As far as finding people like this... We can't really help you.. Unless there is some newb forum i dont know about (I wouldnt recommend a newb site)

Where do you live? Maybe somone from here can play some games...I'm from Houston, Texas, USA. I'll play ya if you can come.

You will have to help me become a better painter though.

 

[Nagashizzar]

If you do not have a GW store who can give you free painting lessons, the GW How to paint citadel miniature is a great place to start!

Two years ago I started WHFB again a 10 years break and bought the book (it comes with a DVD!). it's really well done to learn the basic techniques.

Always remember: practice make perfect!

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1Ev_qLJkxw

 

[Nagashizzar]

The best way to learn to play is to play against a good player in my opinion but if that player is not a nice person, the experience is no really fun.

I suggest you read the thread "Sunny's Challenge" or "Ask Johnny", those kind of threads contains valuables informations!

Few suggested links (there is plenty more!!):

https://www.vampirecounts.net/Thread-Sunny-s-challenge

https://www.vampirecounts.net/Thread-Vampire-Counts-Army-Book-Overview

https://www.vampirecounts.net/Thread-Dear-Johnny

But most important of all, never, never (do I said never?) hesitate to any ask questions! There are really talented players in here who are always happy to help!

 

[Tawg]

I lose like 100% of the time

I dunno what to do though, if you didn't get into the game with a group of friends; I have a fairly large group of friends who I can be bothered to hang out with at least, even if every time we play I'll be the one taking a loss :grave:

But still, I think the game is not as hard to understand as it is to get players to play on a similar level, not tactically but rather, with list making. Try setting up two armies yourself and playing against an opponent, or even better, sit down with a player you know and make list, then switch out to play them against each other. Obviously don't intentionally set up a poor army, try to make one you'd think is fun, or good, which ever your shooting for; The end result would hopefully be that the other player can see where your faults are at list building and help you there.

But from personal experience, it's terribly easy for two list to not be anywhere near the same power level if the players aren't both playing WaaC, and some people just don't understand the game from the perspective of taking the crappier units/flavor or what have you. But I am loathe to take a more filthy list than someone else to "Teach them a lesson" since, honestly no one ends up learning anything except "What I need to learn to beat," rather than "Oh, not being so try-hard can be fun too I guess" or something more profitable.

But really, learning the game shouldn't be that big of a challenge, it's over coming the built-in obstacle that is GW's balancing in general.

 

[Tomfoolery]

The biggest part of losing for me has been when I've been out deployed. The deployment phase is so crucial to this game it's ridiculous. Magic heavy armies I can handle. If everything has 1 or 2+ armor saves I will find a way. If my opponent can deploy his unit that makes my army start moving sideways from the very beginning to reform to meet his lines I ALWAYS lose.

When I played DE I ran Shades in every single game. Scout ruling is far and away one of the best rules in the game. I would try to field at least 2 units of them whenever I could. Deployment wins this game as much as good dice rolls and hard hitting lists.

My best bit of advice is really learn how to deploy your army from someone who is good at it. Ask them why exactly they place certain units in spots, why some units always go next to each other, why they put certain characters in certain units.

Good luck.

 

[Noobafrass]

Nevermind "weak opponents" - find an opponent who will teach you, regardless of skill. There are always people who want more challenge in their local area and who would be all too happy to help you improve so they, too, are challenged

 

[Hinge]

As some have said, finding a patient opponent is the best solution. However, it is up to you to ask. I, for one, am hesitant to give unsolicited advice for fear of coming across as arrogant or a “know it all” (the reputation of my club does not help me there). I believe that many players are interested in increasing/improving the Warhammer community and will spend the time with newer players if prompted.

Reading some of the excellent blogs out there is another great tip.

Also read battle reports. Stick to those that have maps, pictures. Ask yourself why those players may be making those moves as your review them. If the why does not become apparent in the Bat rep, don’t hesitate to ask. AS an infrequent writer of Bat Reps, I like those questions.

Hinge

 

[Yorga]

As some have said, finding a patient opponent is the best solution. However, it is up to you to ask. I, for one, am hesitant to give unsolicited advice for fear of coming across as arrogant or a “know it all” (the reputation of my club does not help me there). I believe that many players are interested in increasing/improving the Warhammer community and will spend the time with newer players if prompted.

Reading some of the excellent blogs out there is another great tip.

Also read battle reports. Stick to those that have maps, pictures. Ask yourself why those players may be making those moves as your review them. If the why does not become apparent in the Bat rep, don’t hesitate to ask. AS an infrequent writer of Bat Reps, I like those questions.



Hinge

Hinge: You are the man! Winning Best Overall with an Orc and Goblin army amongst some of the toughest opponents in Northern California is beyond super. You had to wade through WoC and OK armies galore to get there. Could you please post a link for some of your Batreps for the OP and myself? Pretty please!

And your group is not bad. They are just hardcore competitive. Please tell Ivan to smile more during a game. Especially if he is crushing his opponent. It softens up the hurt. And thank Ed for me again for taking the time to explain to a 16 year old boy how better to deploy his dwarves.

Is the only reason Jeff the winner time and again of QCR because you are unable to compete?

 

[Hinge]

@Yorga-

Lol, thanks. The best part of the weekend is that all 5 games were fun opponents (not always the case at tourney’s). Though I have to admit that after Friday night’s shenanigans, I nearly did not make it through game 2, especially when Micah offered me a shot of some random alcohol. I really need to learn to say no!

Would someone please, please take Jeff down! In all seriousness, I enjoy running the Quake and it gives me the opportunity to contribute back to the hobby and community that I enjoy.

I am predicting this year will be the toughest year I have ever had in judging paint. The Texans will be back looking to repeat last year’s dominance, and I hear they are bringing all knew armies! There is the usual Ld2 crowd but in a shocking development, Johnny may very well have a fully painted army! SoCal has several serious contenders, one of which I voted for as my players choice at the WCGT over Tony and Mike. Last weekend I saw several top notch Sacto Area armies. Two in particular that I thought were awesome but also felt got a little rushed to finish on time. I am hoping both players go back and spend a little more time on them. If so, they are serious, serious contenders.

If you are looking for some of my stuff, a good place to start is a blog I was doing for a while on WoC over at COTEC. Its focus is MSU, which is a tough style to master and the WoC army is not the new book, but the concepts should still apply.

http://s4.zetaboards.com/cotec/topic/943139/1/

Next is a building tactics article that I started but did not finish.

http://s4.zetaboards.com/cotec/topic/9212077/1/#new

I am starting an MSU HE. My first game was done here:

http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=45922

Hope these help.

Michael
Leadership2

PS- I will pass on your message to Ed.

 

[Hinge]

@Yorga-

Lol, thanks. The best part of the weekend is that all 5 games were fun opponents (not always the case at tourney’s). Though I have to admit that after Friday night’s shenanigans, I nearly did not make it through game 2, especially when Micah offered me a shot of some random alcohol. I really need to learn to say no!

Would someone please, please take Jeff down! In all seriousness, I enjoy running the Quake and it gives me the opportunity to contribute back to the hobby and community that I enjoy.

I am predicting this year will be the toughest year I have ever had in judging paint. The Texans will be back looking to repeat last year’s dominance, and I hear they are bringing all knew armies! There is the usual Ld2 crowd but in a shocking development, Johnny may very well have a fully painted army! SoCal has several serious contenders, one of which I voted for as my players choice at the WCGT over Tony and Mike. Last weekend I saw several top notch Sacto Area armies. Two in particular that I thought were awesome but also felt got a little rushed to finish on time. I am hoping both players go back and spend a little more time on them. If so, they are serious, serious contenders.

If you are looking for some of my stuff, a good place to start is a blog I was doing for a while on WoC over at COTEC. Its focus is MSU, which is a tough style to master and the WoC army is not the new book, but the concepts should still apply.

http://s4.zetaboards.com/cotec/topic/943139/1/

Next is a building tactics article that I started but did not finish.

http://s4.zetaboards.com/cotec/topic/9212077/1/#new

I am starting an MSU HE. My first game was done here:

http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=45922

Hope these help.

Michael
Leadership2

PS- I will pass on your message to Ed.

 

[Johnny-Crass]

Hey now I have many a painted army just sometimes i get distrac..... Squirrel!

But props for defeating two of Min/Maxs champions back to back (Micah and Jay). I still want a rematch though sir! Though with my crappy Quake list i doubt i will win

 

[Kindred]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone! I'm still determined to keep at it till I learn, as this game can be so much fun (despite often being rather infuriating at the same time). I find part of my real problem derives from my artistic bent; I seek to make an army that looks aesthetically pleasing with cool models and themes, but this is often in error when it comes to the technical side of the game! Most of my local friends and fellow players are quite the opposite, combing the books for the very strongest unit builds and combinations. I'll take your advice to heart and keep plugging away at it, why i just attended a local tournament and learned some interesting things. Lost every game by a landslide, didn't even score 1 victory point in 3 games, but I did win the painting contest as usual so thats something.:lol:

 

[CarlJackson]

I just start doing painting, it's really a nice thing playing with colors I like this. I'm not really good in this but in the sense of opponents it encourages me to prove the best in me. Soon I will show you my skills.

 

[Ripper]

Set realistic goals for yourself.

Play good players, but set a goal for yourself other than winning. 'This game I'm going to successfully redirect his knights', 'this game I'm going to win the left flank,' 'this game I'm going to take out his war machines by turn 3'.

This is how you learn to be a good player. Learn all the different aspects of winning one at a time, then combine them.

After the game, ask your opponent why he did this/that if you don't understand why he was doing it or how it worked. Ask your opponent what you did wrong.

I basically got tutored by this very good Dark Elves player at the store I played at back home. I played him dozens of times and only won 2 or 3 games. But I learned how to use scouts, skirmishers, chaff, how to cast spells reliably, how to dispel the big spells and which ones to let through, etc... And when I then turned around and played some average players, I crushed them. Even ran through a couple of tournaments that my 'tutor' didn't show up for. He won all the rest.

Point is, you will learn 1000 times more from losing to a good player than you will beating a bad player, provided you treat the game as a learning experience.

You get out of Warhammer what you put into it. If you're a good painter, then you put in the work to get there. Practice, practice, practice.

And above all, resist the urge to blame the book. Every bad player I've ever met blames their opponents' army book after they lose.

 

[Seneschal]

Ripper please look at the date of the last post, it was back in May. We don't bring up threads older than 2 months