Hi!

[VonAlpen]

My fiancée and I are about to start warhammer fantasy.
We are currently living in Scotland.

My fiancée is going to play High Elves.

We were deliberating if it would be better to go Good vs Evil or both having a "Good" army to be able to play together later on.

If I were to take an army of Good, I would pick Empire.

But we are thinking that going Good vs Evil might be more interesting. What do you think?
In this case I am hesitating between Warriors of Chaos and Vampire Counts as both have some stunning models.
I know you will all be biased towards VC, but could you tell me the main differences on how VC and WoC are played, their style of battle, etc...

Thank you in advance,

Von Alpen

 

[Shareya]

vs

Just saying nehe.

Welcome to the forums! Have no fear someone will be along shortly to tell you the differences and why it's more fun to play vC.

 

[VonAlpen]

vs

Just saying nehe.

Welcome to the forums! Have no fear someone will be along shortly to tell you the differences and why it's more fun to play vC.

Thank you,

Haha, Good argument

But zombies are not really more attractive than Nurgle Mosnters

And you could have a Slanesh themed army, with multi-boobs armours

 

[Shareya]

Depends how you make your zombies however! If you check some of the armys people have posted here, they look fantastic <3

 

[VonAlpen]

Depends how you make your zombies however! If you check some of the armys people have posted here, they look fantastic <3

I don't doubt they can look fantastic and I love zombies.
I have got all the Romero movies. But rotting humans are not "attractive" to me

And some Nurgle models also look fantastic in a disgusting kind of way

 

[Shareya]

I was more thinking you can replace the zombie models with something else, like humans and just make it work via fluff! Like Lahmians/Vons using human soldiers spiked up on drugs!

Anyhoo random ranting. I will try to drag raven here to tell more about the game mehanics!

 

[VonAlpen]

I was more thinking you can replace the zombie models with something else, like humans and just make it work via fluff! Like Lahmians/Vons using human soldiers spiked up on drugs!

Anyhoo random ranting. I will try to drag raven here to tell more about the game mehanics!

Haha,

No problem.

Thanks for the input!

 

[Raven Torrid]

I will try to drag raven here to tell more about the game mehanics!

I have been summoned!

Shar, the fact that I know more about tabletop & tactics than you, doesn't really mean I know much about it, does it?

Anyway, I am just a very green beginner, so what I explained to Shar is just my view of things, from experience.

I played vs the new WoC twice recently, and lost miserably.

It was against a list with no infantry. Chariots, Knights, Skullcrushers, Ogres. Very fast, very straightforward, very brutal. As I've heard, the chariot lists are "the" competitive tournament lists. Altho not very interesting/colourful IMO. Certainly there are other variations, but I am yet to meet them. You can combine the 4 Marks of Chaos to your liking, I've played vs Nurgle and Tzeentch and they both prove useful.

As for VC, we have some mechanics that make it interesting to play, and I'd say, encourage/force us to develop tactically.
We can charge only when near the General, we crumble rather than flee, and we crumble if the General dies. So, foolish play can be punished.
With the latest Armybook, we have more options for various viable lists than before. We also have some of the strongest Lord choices and many BSB options.
In general, the VC are considered a strong army, but it does require skill.

I chose them 'cause I love converting (and they have huge potential) and 'cause I like Western Horror Folklore/Mythology.

I'd say, go for whatever you like most in terms of aesthetics and fluff, but it really comes to what part of the hobby appeals to you the most.

 

[VonAlpen]

I will try to drag raven here to tell more about the game mehanics!

I have been summoned!

Shar, the fact that I know more about tabletop & tactics than you, doesn't really mean I know much about it, does it?

Anyway, I am just a very green beginner, so what I explained to Shar is just my view of things, from experience.

I played vs the new WoC twice recently, and lost miserably.

It was against a list with no infantry. Chariots, Knights, Skullcrushers, Ogres. Very fast, very straightforward, very brutal. As I've heard, the chariot lists are "the" competitive tournament lists. Altho not very interesting/colourful IMO. Certainly there are other variations, but I am yet to meet them. You can combine the 4 Marks of Chaos to your liking, I've played vs Nurgle and Tzeentch and they both prove useful.

As for VC, we have some mechanics that make it interesting to play, and I'd say, encourage/force us to develop tactically.
We can charge only when near the General, we crumble rather than flee, and we crumble if the general dies. So, foolish play can be punished.
With the latest Armybook, we have more options for various viable lists than before. We also have some of the strongest Lord choices and many BSB options.
In general, the VC are considered a strong army, but it does require skill.

I chose them 'cause I love converting (and they have huge potential) and 'cause I like Western Horror Folklore/Mythology.

I'd say, go for whatever you like most in terms of aesthetics and fluff, but it really comes to what part of the hobby appeals to you the most.

Model wise I find hard to choose between the two. I think they both have amazing models.

I like strategy and tactics, so that would be a point in favour of Vampires, right?

Well, I have the summer to ponder my choices

Thanks a lot for the info.

 

[Raven Torrid]

Model wise I find hard to choose between the two. I think they both have amazing models.

I like strategy and tactics, so that would be a point in favour of Vampires, right?

Well, I have the summer to ponder my choices

Thanks a lot for the info.

Can't say for WoC as I don't know, but yeah, I think it's an important part of a VC army. Also, there is a nice amount of versatility when making lists, from terrorizing screaming fliers, to loads of infantry, to cavalry.
We also have a great magic lore with some very useful and cheap augments. Vanhel's additional movement also allows for some fun tactical escapades.

Also, be sure to check our tactics forum --> The Teachings of Abhorash

Hopefully, some of our battle-hardened veterans will provide you with more info as well.

You're welcome.

 

[Raven Torrid]

We can charge only when near the General, we crumble rather than flee, and we crumble if the general dies.

Whoops, wrote charge instead of march here. BIG difference. Lapsus.

 

[Aren]

Alpen- welcome! Now, we both know which army Gabriel bellmont and Zobek would get you to choose! Judging by your avatar you are a castlevania fan (LoS2 coming out in winter!!!!).

So, WoC hit like a steam train, crush the enemy in combat and are quite anti magical. VC are very VERY hard to shift in combat, have very good magic and next to no shooting.

Also, nowdays very fast VC lists are all the craze, we are they only army with flying monsterous infantry. We are also all quite dead, we have the most ethereals which are quite good and we have THE BEST LORDS AND HEROES IN THE GAME (not special ones, just generic ones).

 

[VonAlpen]

Alpen- welcome! Now, we both know which army Gabriel bellmont and Zobek would get you to choose! Judging by your avatar you are a castlevania fan (LoS2 coming out in winter!!!!).

So, WoC hit like a steam train, crush the enemy in combat and are quite anti magical. VC are very VERY hard to shift in combat, have very good magic and next to no shooting.

Also, nowdays very fast VC lists are all the craze, we are they only army with flying monsterous infantry. We are also all quite dead, we have the most ethereals which are quite good and we have THE BEST LORDS AND HEROES IN THE GAME (not special ones, just generic ones).

Thanks for the input.

I wouldn't say I am a fan, but I really like the looks of their vampires.

I am leaning towards VC, but I really don't like the Ghouls.
Can you play efficiently with only zombies and skeletons as core?

 

[Aren]

Definitely. Also, give the wolves a shot, used right they are proper beasts (pun oh so very much intended ). VC are so good because almost every single unit is viable. Ghouls are no longer a must take.

Which bloodline do you sway towards?

 

[kevin.hopkins7]

Yup, but you definitely want some dire wolves too. That will take away from spending too much on skellies n zombies, and having "chaff " type units are great! Like said above, "the teachings of Abhorash" section has some threads on how to use "chaff" units". Here is a recent one. Fast Chaff Tactics

Many uses and super important. Hands down our best core unit is dire wolves. You don't need 600+ points of them, which in typical 2400-2500 point games you need that much core allotment, but at least 3 units. If you don't like wolves though, some fell bat and spirit host units will work too.

Oh and welcome to the forum!

Edit: ninja'd!

 

[VonAlpen]

Definitely. Also, give the wolves a shot, used right they are proper beasts (pun oh so very much intended ). VC are so good because almost every single unit is viable. Ghouls are no longer a must take.

Which bloodline do you sway towards?

Probably Von Carstein, as I don't really want knights (Blood knights are off), not really attracted by the all female stuff, and I want human looking vampires (I love the models for Vlad and Isabella)
For the fluff I'd probably say my army is part of a lesser branch of the family, and come up with my own background.

Yup, but you definitely want some dire wolves too. That will take away from spending too much on skellies n zombies, and having "chaff " type units are great! Like said above, "the teachings of Abhorash" section has some threads on how to use "chaff" units". Here is a recent one. Fast Chaff Tactics

Many uses and super important. Hands down our best core unit is dire wolves. You don't need 600+ points of them, which in typical 2400-2500 point games you need that much core allotment, but at least 3 units. If you don't like wolves though, some fell bat and spirit host units will work too.

Oh and welcome to the forum!

Edit: ninja'd!

I was talking about the main infantry blocks.
I really like the Spirit Hosts.
And I would not mind having Dire Wolves and Fell bats.

It is just the ghouls I want nothing to do with.

 

[kevin.hopkins7]

It is just the ghouls I want nothing to do with.

I don't blame ya, the current models are funky, and the previous ones were as well (although I kinda like them, just not enough poses)

 

[VonAlpen]

It is just the ghouls I want nothing to do with.

I don't blame ya, the current models are funky, and the previous ones were as well (although I kinda like them, just not enough poses)

I do not like the models and don't really like the idea of them either.

 

[Aren]

The GW ones are just really goofy, massive hands and stupid facial expressions. The mantic ghouls are a bit more serious and support the fluff more but I can see why you don't like ghouls. Especially if you're going for a Blood Dragon, Lahmian or Von Cartstein army.

Though if you're going for cheap then skellies cost A LOT because you need so many. Ghouls are the cheapest way to build your core but if money is not a problem then go for wolves and skeletons and such. Just don't buy zombies from GW, they suck and you will regret it...

 

[VonAlpen]

The GW ones are just really goofy, massive hands and stupid facial expressions. The mantic ghouls are a bit more serious and support the fluff more but I can see why you don't like ghouls. Especially if you're going for a Blood Dragon, Lahmian or Von Cartstein army.

Though if you're going for cheap then skellies cost A LOT because you need so many. Ghouls are the cheapest way to build your core but if money is not a problem then go for wolves and skeletons and such. Just don't buy zombies from GW, they suck and you will regret it...

I agree that GW zombies are horrible, I'll go Mantic for them.
I like the GW skeletons.
Money-wise I'll get my army bit by bit. Paint what I got then buy some more.