How do you use a Varghulf?

[Vipoid]

Basically the title.

I like the Varghulf model, but I really struggle to do anything with him.

Basically, I tend to find that there's no unit he can 'safely' charge. i.e., either the units are stronger than him, or they're ranked and so will probably kill him by CR (especially in the second round, when he's lost hatred).

Most of my games, he just meanders around, trying (often in vain) to flank something.

At the moment, I've replaced him with a terrorgheist.

However, I thought I'd ask if anyone else has these problems, and how they overcome them. I know that the varghulf is quite a popular unit, so I'm interested to know how people use one effectively?

 

[Count Lasombra]

I find it pretty easy to get in my opponents flank arc w/ Varghulfs.March 16" into their flank arc and turn in.I Use them to stick large blocks of enemy core in place.The charging and flank bonuses coupled with hatred and thunderstomp usually counteract their rank bonus/standard.
They will be still be steadfast ofcourse,but your still killing them,and holding them in place.They will want to reform to face you,but if you are maintaining forward pressure they will be unable to do so w/o giving up some flank.If you combo chrge them with spirit hosts sthey are quite paralyzed-barring magical intervention.
This has just been my experience-your mileage may vary.

 

[Johnny-Crass]

He has two roles in my current army

1. Make sure the dragon rider does not loose her combats and also hunt any warmachines
2. Chaff to save the dragon rider from a flank charge

Really in my kind of list he is built to die

 

[eggsPR]

He makes an excellent paper weight

 

[Rizzo]

I put him in a Mortis Engine list to experiment. He can often get the charge off on chariots, he will ruin a chariot's day.

 

[midean]

I use him all the time and find very little he can't do on the flanks. With terror he can scare off most units outside of the Generals influence. He can destroy small units all by himself.He is a lot smaller target on a 50x50 base and can slip thru areas with ease. I love the guy and try to fit him in on a lot of my list....

 

[Ether Dude]

When you're playing be mindful that you've only got ld 4 for redirect/restraint purposes. Essentially, treat him like a vargheist that can't fly.

 

[Narenzade]

He's meant to flank charge along with another unit. Keep him on the flank of your Ghoul / Vampire Lord unit. He will make the boom boom.

 

[Adam_Barrow]

When you're playing be mindful that you've only got ld 4 for redirect/restraint purposes. Essentially, treat him like a vargheist that can't fly.

I prefer the way Daddy Vargs move to Little Vargs some days. No Frenzy is a good trade for -4" March Move, in my opinion.

 

[CGBSpender]

It's also nice that he has a decent save from regeneration. I like running them in pairs and charge both of them into the same flank to get double tstomp.

 

[datalink7]

The Vargheist is actually pretty decent IMO. It can operate by itself, has a fairly small footprint, does a decent amount of damage and fairly survivable. The only problem is that it is competing with other good things, like a Terrorgheist which is generally a bit better overall.

I found he works well with 2 of them as two can charge something and beat the rank bonus with 2x thunderstomps. Ore he works well killing chaff and warmachines before helping out in another combat later on.

 

[PrinceCharming]

He makes an excellent paper weight

HAHAHAHA, i use mine as an objective marker, HAHAHAHA

 

[rothgar13]

Apart from his amazing uses at holding things down with its weight (only applicable to those who bought the metal models, since the resin one is too light to pin much of anything), I'd say his two main uses are to run around cleaning out chaff (since most light units don't have a prayer against a Terror-causing, 5 WS5 S5 Hatred Monster), and to catch cannonballs in order to protect something more important to the army's function (like, say, a Terrorgheist).

I also wouldn't be so quick to dismiss him as part of mainstream army composition. Given that you can squeeze him into a 2500 Rare allowance along with 2 Terrorgheists, there has to be some way to incorporate him into a list, right?

 

[Johnny-Crass]

Problem I have found more and more is he is very prone to being march blocked:slapface:

 

[Aren]

A varg is always useful in a list. A fast monster that while not being amazing is still very good against most things, especially in skaven or empire lists. For the points they are amazing, sure it is not as much of a threat as 20 GG but point for point he is better as he is fast, a threat that if your enemy ignores he will murder warmachines, mages and other shooting things but if the enemy doesn't ignore him he will soak up their shooting, letting the rest of your army get in combat range. Obviously don't charge him head on, flank charges are essential as on the charge there is a good chance he will rout something (terror and then CR) and if not then that unit will have to turn to kill him and so expose themselves to more flank charges. More survivable than vargheists ( 3 vargheists compared to 1 varghulf, I think I proved it in a different post but againts 10 swordmasters they kill 3 vargheists first so no attacks back but against a Varghulf they do 3 wounds and so he gets to attack back doing 5 wounds, winning the combat) but this only works in smaller games. In small games these guys are awesome but in larger ones vargheists come out on top, doing more wounds. If there is a significant amount of them. Plus SM are one of the ultimate glass cannon units so our glass cannons which go last are not really expected to stand up to them. Yet I hate testing against chaff as chances are you are not going to be facing chaff. The better a player you are the more you get out of these guys and it depends on the rest of your army, if you lack speed in your army then take one or three

 

[Aedin]

Best all time use for a Varg is a wizard assassin. Charge him into the wizard bunker and take ALL his melee attacks against the wizard and kill him then stomp the unit for combat res. Even if he dies the expense of the wizard you kill will offset the loss and furthermore, your oppent will have no choice but to let your magic phase go unchecked which is usually a big V+V (victory for vampires)..

Other good uses as stated is chaff removal, chariot removal, and war machine removal.

Hope this helps.

 

[Vipoid]

Thanks for all the responses, guys.

With regard to the last post, I fear a wizard-hunter varghulf won't be viable. My main opponents are:
- Khorne Daemons of Chaos
- Warriors of Chaos
- Ogre Kingdoms
- Lizardmen

The former doesn't use wizards, WoC and OK wizards are both pretty damn resilient (even without defensive upgrades), and expecting a varghulf to survive multiple turns against their squad seems dubious. Lizardmen get to ignore about half the rules relating to wizards, and can bunker their slaan in the second rank (making them unassailable to the varghulf).

 

[rothgar13]

Yep, that Varghulf won't be doing a whole lot of Wizard-hunting. Bad suite of matchups you have there.

 

[Johnny-Crass]

It is easy to get skink priests with a varghulf though!.... Oh wait....:swear:

 

[BloodbathMcGrath]

Yes but he could flank rnf daemons; eat woc chariots; engage leadbelchers and maybe ironblasters; and flank rnf lizards or catch some skinks if they don't shoot the hell out of him.

But yeah, ideally his prey doesn't fight back as much erv:

 

[rothgar13]

I don't know about "eating" WoC Chariots - I'd favor the Nurgle Gorebeast Chariot over the Varghulf in a fight, even if the Varg charged. It works out like so:

Varghulf v. Gorebeast Chariot, Mark of Nurgle

Varghulf charges.

Chaos Charioteers strike first. 4 attacks, hitting on 4+, wounding on 4+, allowing 4+ Regen.

Math: (4)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2) = 0.50

Varghulf strikes second. 5 attacks, hitting on 5+ with a re-roll, wounding on 5+, allowing 5+ armor.

Math: (5)*(5/9)*(1/3)*(2/3) = 0.62

Gorebeast strikes third. 3 attacks, hitting on 4+, wounding on 4+, allowing 4+ Regen.

Math: (3)*(1/2)*(1/2)*(1/2) = 0.38

Yeah, that's not looking great (0.88 to 0.62 in favor of WoC, and the Varghulf's output drops to 0.37 after Round 1). And if you get charged... forget about it. You probably win Round 1 because you charged, and that's your shot to break it (but it'll be testing at -1 at most). Core Chariots, on the other hand, it can handle fairly easily.

 

[BloodbathMcGrath]

Well isn't the gorebest chariot like 1 or 2 toughness higher or something? (My book is at my cousin's house...) But you're right, maybe he won't be eating chariots, but assuming he isn't charged, he can give some of them a run for their money. Problem is WoC have so much hard stuff now. Chimera as special? Yes please!

 

[rothgar13]

The Gorebeast Chariot is T6, yes. It's a pretty good buy for the points, as long as you use it for what it's good at (slamming into blocks or monsters and grinding them down), and don't try to use it like a Core Chariot (it won't be doing a whole lot of chaff hunting in the flanks and stuff).