is 1 lvl 4 enough?

[estwheadn]

Hey guys,
Im trying to build my knight bus list and just can't find points to put in another wizard besides my VL.

What do you more experienced players think? Do you usually bring a back up? second lvl 4? lvl 2 for spell selection? Or is the main reason to bring another wizard to avoid crumbling?

and i suppose for context here's my list:

++ Vampire Counts - Army Book (2013-4) -V8.8.1. (Standard) (2496pts) ++

+ Lords (545pts) +

Vampire Lord (545pts) [Heavy Armour, Lance, Lore of the Vampires, Quickblood, Red Fury, Summon Creatures of the Night, Wizard Level 4]
····Barded Nightmare [Nightmare]
····Magic Items [AB - Book of Arkhan, BRB - Charmed Shield, BRB - Talisman of Preservation, BRB - The Other Trickster's Shard]

+ Heroes (164pts) +

Wight King (164pts) [Lance, Shield]
····Magic Items [AB - Nightshroud, BRB - Ironcurse Icon, BRB - Luckstone]
····Skeletal Steed [Barding, Skeletal Steed]

+ Core (625pts) +

Dire Wolves (40pts) [5x Dire Wolf]

Dire Wolves (40pts) [5x Dire Wolf]

Dire Wolves (40pts) [5x Dire Wolf]

Skeleton Warriors (345pts) [Champion, Musician, 60x Skeleton Warrior]
····Standard Bearer [BRB - Banner of Swiftness]

Zombies (160pts) [Musician, Standard Bearer, 50x Zombie]

+ Special (937pts) +

Black Knights (320pts)
····10x Black Knight [10x Barding, 10x Lances]
····Standard Bearer [AB - Banner of the Barrows]
····Steed [Skeletal Steed]

Crypt Horrors (314pts) [Champion, 8x Crypt Horror]

Fell Bats (32pts) [2x Fell Bat]

Fell Bats (32pts) [2x Fell Bat]

Spirit Host (45pts) [Spirt Host]

Vargheists (194pts) [Champion, 4x Vargheist]

+ Rare (225pts) +

Terrorgheist (225pts)

Created with BattleScribe

 

[LordTobiothan]

A second level 4 is only for armies that really want two different lores to choose from.

You very likely won't need that and you can dip into other lores with level 2 ' s.

Depending on your level of experience, you can run double master necromancer armies, but vampire lords are nearly always better and of you are asking this question then you probably aren't going to be comfortable running two squishy level 4's.

 

[estwheadn]

You know the way I phrased it, it seems like I'm asking if I need multiple lvl4s. What I meant to ask is whether or not a single lvl4 wizard is enough wizards, or whether I need a necro lvl 1 or 2 as well the VL

 

[Pirate Robot Ninja of Death]

Depends on the army, on the lore, and on what sort of reliance you have on spells.

The benefit of a level 2 in VC is that you get an extra invocation, and a dud spell that helps you get what you want on the level 4. That can be valuable.
However the bigger reason for the secondary caster is to caddy a dispel scroll, which can straight up win games (by preventing you from losing one).

You can also splash a secondary lore, preferably one with a solid sig spell that you can cast reliably on two dice. Heavens and Shadow are both solid, though honestly I'd rather have more Vampires 9 times out of 10.

I would say none of those things are worth spending 100 points on in your list though, unless you felt it necessary.

 

[shred.]

The only thing that I'd be concerned about with only running a level 4 vampire lord is the risk of miscasts. Since you only have one caster, every time you roll the dice it's a gamble whether you'll accidentally miscast. I've had numerous games where I've lost my VL to a dimensional cascade on turn 1 or 2, or have lost wizard levels (and the spells) by only having rolled 2 dice.

This isn't to discourage you from running a VL as the same drawbacks apply to MN, but it is something that happens with our army (assuming you're playing VC and not UL).

 

[The Sun King]

I moved the thread to the appropriate forum @estwheadn

 

[TheTrans]

I'd find an extra 95points, drop the vamp to level 1, take a level 4 necro...

That way only a 200pt model goes down a hole if you balls up..as opposed to your lord..

 

[The Sun King]

I agree with @TheTrans - that is the most safe build.

 

[estwheadn]

so maybe drop a vargheist and swap banner of barrows for the lichebone pendant, then drop the levels and get a MN lvl 4? I could take 10 skellies from the unit of 60 to make a small bus for the MN. Do you guys think that is a stronger list? Maybe drop the spirit host instead?

 

[TheTrans]

Use zombies as the necro bus mate.