I wanted to create this to post mini-battle reports and reviews of matches players (Myself or others, feel free to post yours) have had with this new rule system.
Many people may fear issues with balance, and I think at the very least a thread like this can help us gain a feel for what might have been overboard.
Besides, many people fear the new system, and while I am not wholly vested in it, I feel that experience with it is a million times more powerful that simple conjecture. I too don't like the look of the game that much, but playing it helps me understand what I hate, or if what I think I would hate is even a problem.
So without further adieu, here is a short report:
I brought up two armies, just encase I found a player looking to play but without anything to play, because my 2nd-hand Ogres are a few units strong, so enough for a quick game to dip my feet.
When I got up to the store, I found a few players going at Warmahordes. I picked up my pre-ordered WD, expressed some concerns for the new system to the store manager (Just a FLGS, no GW near me of course), and watched them play for a bit. After flipping through the WD for a while, all stuff I've seen before due to the massive amount of leaks over the past few days, I got a chance to ask the two playing if either would like a match to try out AoS, and they both seemed interested. As it turned out one actually brought his dwarves. So he scribbled down the Dwarf Warscrolls really quick, then we pulled out a few units to play. I can't name everything he had, but I can approximate:
He laid out maybe 10-15 Longgunners (I assume that's what they were), 1 Orgran Cannon, 10 Ironbeards (The 2-h melee guys?) and a random champ for a lord/hero, what ever it was.
I took a 6-man Ogre unit, 6-man Ironguts, 4-man Leadbelcher, and a Firebelly for general.
Now at this point, I honestly had no idea what was going to happen, or what to expect for if we were at a fair value of points. I never even played my Ogres - well, ever actually - and I have not played dwarves so I had no expectations for previous "balance" of what would have been good before. We just set out about the same amount of units, mine were just huge compared to his.
Then we set about playing, we set up terrain on a 4'x4' and declared some random effects for them, 2-deadly forest (Btw, deadly means deadly), 2-inspiring Hills and 1-Corrupt ruins, or what ever the one you can Sac wounds to for To Hit bonus. The set up proceeded, then I took first turn.
The game is straight forward, no way around that. It's simple, and even while going slowly to try and not miss things, we didn't take very long at all. First turn was nothing, since you default to setting up 12" from opponents ZONE, that means there is always that full 2' gap at the start. Ogre's moved forwards, not even close enough to shoot. Pass.
His turn he steps forwards running with his Ironbeards, which I thought a bit silly because why would you want to set yourself up for a charge, right? What ever, he shot with the cannon, and it was pretty scary. It's a huge risk-reward cannon too: It fires up to 4d6 shots, but you have to roll a die equal or over the number of dice you roll or it jams. So he fires 3d6, doesn't jam and does some work on my leadbelchers. Man down very quickly. Nothing else for the turn, so we Battleshock my 'Belchers and all I have to do is not roll a 6. I rolled a 6. One peels off over the hill they're standing next to, ouch.
Then we roll off for initiative (As every pair of turns the order could change), and he gets it. Running towards your foe when you're on the bottom of the turn makes more sense to me suddenly. Luckily for me stunty-legs can only move 4" so they still are closing the gap, and he doesn't run to preserve his chance to charge. The Organ-gun locks and loads 3 again and jams, and the Long-gunners pelt the 'Belchers. A few more wounds come of it, and then I am hit by the thought that if that Ogre was close enough to run away over the hill (The unit was indeed within 3") then they had +1 Bravery. My opponent generously allows me to place the model back on board due to the mistake ("Hey guys, I found my lucky ham I lost!") and another 'Belcher dies. He fails charges, and my turn comes up.
I decide that sacrificing to the dark-ruins-gods-of-death seems like a good idea, my ogres being a solid 8" away from the stunties, so they sacrificed their prized pork-belly (And 3 wounds) for +1 To Hit. The Ironguts are on the other side of the ruins, and on the completely wrong side of the board, so they run ... 2" extra.. it's hard being fat (And carrying that much armour?). I think better of sending my General into the thick of the fighting, as the Firebelly is scarcely that good of a hero (Tyrants are the fighter types), and the 'Belchers advance as well. It's wroth noting that while there is no restriction on moving/shooting, the Leadbelchers fire d6 shots per standing still, and d3 when moving. They unload into the Organ-Gun and I cause 2Ws, which go onto the cannon. I was not aware Cannons took wounds until that point, but apparently they only have 4 anyways, a bit different than previously untouchable war-machines where you just kill the crew. Anyways, moving to the Ogre's favorite belly-flopping part of the turn, charges. I got fully up against the imaginary 3" wall between our models, and I roll for charge. Anything but a snake-eyes (Echoed by both players as the dice fell). I, for my part, rolled snake-eyes. The Ogres are not having this, perhaps because I still don't use their proper name Ogors.
The Dwarf player rears up and moves his army about positioning to try to press what little advantage he has left. At this point we discover the glaringly obvious lack of rules reference to not being able to shoot into (Or out of) combats, so we agree that we'll play it as such. His army rounds about and proceeds to pelt a few of my units with Long-gunners, and the Organ-gun jams again. His leader charges the rear of my Leadbelchers and we fight. He puts out some wounds, I kill one of his with a save (Weird mechanic, but ok). Then I attack back and the 2-h Dwarves are killed to a man, shockingly fast, I think I underestimated the generic Ogre's 3-4+-3+-2Damage attacks. In turn his Leader smashes the rest of the 'Blechers, and this leaves my Ogres standing in the open, and his leader generally the same.
Subsequently he was hoping to grab Initiative to avoid his leader being smashed alive. Naturally he did not get it. The Ogre's turn on him, eyeing their next pocket-sized treat. At this point the Ironguts have realized there is indeed a fight occurring, and make a b-line for the cannon which is now closest to them. Leader-stuff happened, not terribly much impact to be had. 'Belchers are dead, I have no more shooting. The Ogre's charge the Dwarf surrounding him on all sides, and the Ironguts make it into the cannon, however three passed though the deadly forest, and only two came out. I guess he ran into a tree, or maybe found a tasty treat worth abandoning his friends for. Either way, combat ensues, and with current player taking first swing, the Dwarf lord is quickly reduced to a tasty treat for the Og-- err.. Nix that, apparently Ogre's hit for shit, and he is left with one wound. He strikes back and finishes an Ogre. Meanwhile the Ironguts prove their worth by.. smashing the Cannon that was nearly ineffective all game, well it's the thought that counts.
His turn, he elects not to retreat (I actually am not sure if we ever considered this option, or just consigned him to death due to forgetting he could run). In any case, the cannon is now gone, the Long gunners shoot, and charge in boldly. Then combat continues and his Army is basically gone.
On the Fifth and last turn, I finished the game with a magic missile on the last 2 crew of the Cannon.
Now, it may sound like I rather enjoyed this game. Yes and no. It was a fine game between two players, and I thought for complete strangers we got on well. The system feels a little shaky though. After this game I still had my doubts, and while I interjected silly little side comments throughout, I find the silliness contained within the published rules for the game to cause me a bit of distress. I could embrace this game much more wholly if I didn't feel like GW had staffed a person who was a failed comic as their main rules writer. Their only rules writer.
The core of the game is functional. You can roll to hit, to wound. There are interactions to be had with units and terrain. And barring those of the "slap-stick" nature, it's decently sound and reasonable. Certainly it can be off putting to not have a stern a guide as our previous points limits to tell us what to use. I felt slightly like I cheated against him, although honestly my Ironguts almost didn't even get into the match. I don't know if Ogres are very powerful, or what the balance problem we had was, but in the end, we both had a decent time. We both got to enjoy a quick game (Under 2-hours for a match learning the system seems pretty quick), and afterwards we shook hands and tidied up.
Many people may fear issues with balance, and I think at the very least a thread like this can help us gain a feel for what might have been overboard.
Besides, many people fear the new system, and while I am not wholly vested in it, I feel that experience with it is a million times more powerful that simple conjecture. I too don't like the look of the game that much, but playing it helps me understand what I hate, or if what I think I would hate is even a problem.
So without further adieu, here is a short report:
I brought up two armies, just encase I found a player looking to play but without anything to play, because my 2nd-hand Ogres are a few units strong, so enough for a quick game to dip my feet.
When I got up to the store, I found a few players going at Warmahordes. I picked up my pre-ordered WD, expressed some concerns for the new system to the store manager (Just a FLGS, no GW near me of course), and watched them play for a bit. After flipping through the WD for a while, all stuff I've seen before due to the massive amount of leaks over the past few days, I got a chance to ask the two playing if either would like a match to try out AoS, and they both seemed interested. As it turned out one actually brought his dwarves. So he scribbled down the Dwarf Warscrolls really quick, then we pulled out a few units to play. I can't name everything he had, but I can approximate:
He laid out maybe 10-15 Longgunners (I assume that's what they were), 1 Orgran Cannon, 10 Ironbeards (The 2-h melee guys?) and a random champ for a lord/hero, what ever it was.
I took a 6-man Ogre unit, 6-man Ironguts, 4-man Leadbelcher, and a Firebelly for general.
Now at this point, I honestly had no idea what was going to happen, or what to expect for if we were at a fair value of points. I never even played my Ogres - well, ever actually - and I have not played dwarves so I had no expectations for previous "balance" of what would have been good before. We just set out about the same amount of units, mine were just huge compared to his.
SET UP
Then we set about playing, we set up terrain on a 4'x4' and declared some random effects for them, 2-deadly forest (Btw, deadly means deadly), 2-inspiring Hills and 1-Corrupt ruins, or what ever the one you can Sac wounds to for To Hit bonus. The set up proceeded, then I took first turn.
First Turn
The game is straight forward, no way around that. It's simple, and even while going slowly to try and not miss things, we didn't take very long at all. First turn was nothing, since you default to setting up 12" from opponents ZONE, that means there is always that full 2' gap at the start. Ogre's moved forwards, not even close enough to shoot. Pass.
His turn he steps forwards running with his Ironbeards, which I thought a bit silly because why would you want to set yourself up for a charge, right? What ever, he shot with the cannon, and it was pretty scary. It's a huge risk-reward cannon too: It fires up to 4d6 shots, but you have to roll a die equal or over the number of dice you roll or it jams. So he fires 3d6, doesn't jam and does some work on my leadbelchers. Man down very quickly. Nothing else for the turn, so we Battleshock my 'Belchers and all I have to do is not roll a 6. I rolled a 6. One peels off over the hill they're standing next to, ouch.
Second Turn
Then we roll off for initiative (As every pair of turns the order could change), and he gets it. Running towards your foe when you're on the bottom of the turn makes more sense to me suddenly. Luckily for me stunty-legs can only move 4" so they still are closing the gap, and he doesn't run to preserve his chance to charge. The Organ-gun locks and loads 3 again and jams, and the Long-gunners pelt the 'Belchers. A few more wounds come of it, and then I am hit by the thought that if that Ogre was close enough to run away over the hill (The unit was indeed within 3") then they had +1 Bravery. My opponent generously allows me to place the model back on board due to the mistake ("Hey guys, I found my lucky ham I lost!") and another 'Belcher dies. He fails charges, and my turn comes up.
I decide that sacrificing to the dark-ruins-gods-of-death seems like a good idea, my ogres being a solid 8" away from the stunties, so they sacrificed their prized pork-belly (And 3 wounds) for +1 To Hit. The Ironguts are on the other side of the ruins, and on the completely wrong side of the board, so they run ... 2" extra.. it's hard being fat (And carrying that much armour?). I think better of sending my General into the thick of the fighting, as the Firebelly is scarcely that good of a hero (Tyrants are the fighter types), and the 'Belchers advance as well. It's wroth noting that while there is no restriction on moving/shooting, the Leadbelchers fire d6 shots per standing still, and d3 when moving. They unload into the Organ-Gun and I cause 2Ws, which go onto the cannon. I was not aware Cannons took wounds until that point, but apparently they only have 4 anyways, a bit different than previously untouchable war-machines where you just kill the crew. Anyways, moving to the Ogre's favorite belly-flopping part of the turn, charges. I got fully up against the imaginary 3" wall between our models, and I roll for charge. Anything but a snake-eyes (Echoed by both players as the dice fell). I, for my part, rolled snake-eyes. The Ogres are not having this, perhaps because I still don't use their proper name Ogors.
Third Turn
A funny thing happens at the bottom of the turn though. Your failed charges turn into "Oh, I was just building up momentum to get in there.." Initiative for the turn, 3 to 6 my favor. Dole out some Inspiration (General ability), and magic missile on the cannon (That thing is scary), and we move on to movement. The 'Belchers wobble forwards a bit, the Ogres continue to gruff up the ground like a charging bull, and the Ironguts keep trying to find what we're even fighting. The 'Belchers shot into the 2-handed Dwarves, and everything was set. The Ogre's throw their lot in with the 2-handed Dwarves (Making it this time), and the 'Belchers decide they want to have some of the same fun. After moving units in, we exchange a bit of blows and the Dwarves suffer a handful of losses, while the Ogres lose a model or two (Or three, who knows it was 10 hours ago). Either way, they are Inspired by their leader, I'm inspired by mine, and we move on.
The Dwarf player rears up and moves his army about positioning to try to press what little advantage he has left. At this point we discover the glaringly obvious lack of rules reference to not being able to shoot into (Or out of) combats, so we agree that we'll play it as such. His army rounds about and proceeds to pelt a few of my units with Long-gunners, and the Organ-gun jams again. His leader charges the rear of my Leadbelchers and we fight. He puts out some wounds, I kill one of his with a save (Weird mechanic, but ok). Then I attack back and the 2-h Dwarves are killed to a man, shockingly fast, I think I underestimated the generic Ogre's 3-4+-3+-2Damage attacks. In turn his Leader smashes the rest of the 'Blechers, and this leaves my Ogres standing in the open, and his leader generally the same.
Fourth Turn
Subsequently he was hoping to grab Initiative to avoid his leader being smashed alive. Naturally he did not get it. The Ogre's turn on him, eyeing their next pocket-sized treat. At this point the Ironguts have realized there is indeed a fight occurring, and make a b-line for the cannon which is now closest to them. Leader-stuff happened, not terribly much impact to be had. 'Belchers are dead, I have no more shooting. The Ogre's charge the Dwarf surrounding him on all sides, and the Ironguts make it into the cannon, however three passed though the deadly forest, and only two came out. I guess he ran into a tree, or maybe found a tasty treat worth abandoning his friends for. Either way, combat ensues, and with current player taking first swing, the Dwarf lord is quickly reduced to a tasty treat for the Og-- err.. Nix that, apparently Ogre's hit for shit, and he is left with one wound. He strikes back and finishes an Ogre. Meanwhile the Ironguts prove their worth by.. smashing the Cannon that was nearly ineffective all game, well it's the thought that counts.
His turn, he elects not to retreat (I actually am not sure if we ever considered this option, or just consigned him to death due to forgetting he could run). In any case, the cannon is now gone, the Long gunners shoot, and charge in boldly. Then combat continues and his Army is basically gone.
On the Fifth and last turn, I finished the game with a magic missile on the last 2 crew of the Cannon.
Now, it may sound like I rather enjoyed this game. Yes and no. It was a fine game between two players, and I thought for complete strangers we got on well. The system feels a little shaky though. After this game I still had my doubts, and while I interjected silly little side comments throughout, I find the silliness contained within the published rules for the game to cause me a bit of distress. I could embrace this game much more wholly if I didn't feel like GW had staffed a person who was a failed comic as their main rules writer. Their only rules writer.
The core of the game is functional. You can roll to hit, to wound. There are interactions to be had with units and terrain. And barring those of the "slap-stick" nature, it's decently sound and reasonable. Certainly it can be off putting to not have a stern a guide as our previous points limits to tell us what to use. I felt slightly like I cheated against him, although honestly my Ironguts almost didn't even get into the match. I don't know if Ogres are very powerful, or what the balance problem we had was, but in the end, we both had a decent time. We both got to enjoy a quick game (Under 2-hours for a match learning the system seems pretty quick), and afterwards we shook hands and tidied up.
