Necros or no no?

[_Revan_]

Im not sure that would be the case. I read through the Bound Item section, but it only stated that the Wizard does not break if it fails, and that if his concentration has broken earlier in the phase he can still use the item.

Where else would you recommend looking for clarification?

 

[Lord Fear]

You just posted the exact thing that answered your own question

"it only stated that the Wizard does not break if it fails"

So, what does it mean if the wizard's concentration isn't broken? It means he keep casting. As VHD is a Necromantic spell, it can be cast repeatedly. Combine the two rules, and job's a good 'un.

 

[_Revan_]

Hmmm, seems to me that they are independent from one another, and that the Wizard has nothing to do with the casting, since even mundane characters can take Bound Items and cast them.

I would interpret that to mean that the Wizard can cast any spells in his own repitoire if the bound spell fails, and can cast the bound spell even if he has failed earlier.

The fact that they are treated as normal spells that bound to (usually) items that are, in a way, a seperate Wizard would indicate to me that the Book could essentially have Broken Concentration.

 

[Count Lasombra]

It's one of those RAW vs. RAI things.I bet it gets errata'd or FAQ'd soon.
Like many things in life,it doesn't seem quite right,but I will do it if allowed erv:

 

[Lord Fear]

The fact that they are treated as normal spells that bound to (usually) items that are, in a way, a seperate Wizard would indicate to me that the Book could essentially have Broken Concentration.

Well, no. The rules specifically mention the wizard not breaking concentration in the rules for bound items- so, there you go. Just take the rules as what they say. We don't need anything else. If there was any intent for the magic item to be treated as some sentient being that can have broken concentration, then the rules would have to say.

At the heart of the issue, of course, is that the rules aren't written to cover a bound item that casts a re-castable spell, so they just didn't think to cover the rule one way or another. Since we can't possibly know intent (unless you're like a zillion times more arrogant than me ). But without a rule giving this specific situation any exceptions, all we know is that failing a bound casting doesn't break concentration, and that you can recast VHD as much as you like. Anything else is making stuff up!

 

[Rökindja]

I strongly dislike using necros. they can only be lev one, so they wont get to cast anything next to a lord. most games in 8th that I've played , i wasn't using them. he is mostly useful as a caddy, and on the other hand I think 80pts, is to expensive for a scroll. scroll always comes in handy though...i will use a caddy for the oncoming tournament, but i'm not too happy about this.

 

[Balleflass]

I strongly dislike using necros. they can only be lev one, so they wont get to cast anything next to a lord. most games in 8th that I've played , i wasn't using them. he is mostly useful as a caddy, and on the other hand I think 80pts, is to expensive for a scroll. scroll always comes in handy though...i will use a caddy for the oncoming tournament, but i'm not too happy about this.

Have u ever tried a Necro with Book Of Arkhan? it effin rocks and most of my playmates hate him for hes easy VDM spamming. plus he gives u another channeler AND u can 1 dice raise IoN without the fear of breaking concentration or ur lord. I always have a Necro with me, either SoD or BoA and in some rare cases a Dispel Scroll, but i rarely meet magic heavy armies.

 

[Rökindja]

just to give you an insight of my gaming community.we will be having a tournament in a couple of days, and 95% of players will have a lev 4 caster.in this kind of environment, necros cant cast a thing...i haven't tried out bound spell items. i don't see the use.i have to use 2PD if i want to be sure, and they can dispel it no problem with their +4. spending PD, and not getting level bonus on the cast is, for me, useless.

 

[shotgunbadger]

Never leave home without one with a Book of Ark, gives good work for its cost as long as you don't go nuts.

 

[Grim Reaper]

Im going to use a necro with the book of arkhan

 

[Count Lasombra]

I'm sold,necro + BOA FTW!
Just dare his lvl 4 to dice off against you.:devil2:

 

[autti]

just to give you an insight of my gaming community.we will be having a tournament in a couple of days, and 95% of players will have a lev 4 caster.in this kind of environment, necros cant cast a thing...i haven't tried out bound spell items. i don't see the use.i have to use 2PD if i want to be sure, and they can dispel it no problem with their +4. spending PD, and not getting level bonus on the cast is, for me, useless.

Well, consider this: You get, say 7PD, and your opponent 4DD. As your first spell, you cast VHD using the book, so you get 2/3 change of successful casting with a single die. If you fail, you lose one die and keep casting with your vamp. In case you get the spell off, your opponent faces three viable options (well, more if he has more than one caster):

1) Choosing not to dispel. VHD for the price of single die, hooray.
2) Dispelling with a single die. 2/3 chance to dispel successfully, the magic phase goes on with 6PD and 3DD. 1/3 chance of rolling an unmodified 1 or 2, which of course is the jackpot, as you get to keep your VHD and your opponent can't benefit from his +4 dispelling modifier for the rest of your magic phase.
3) Dispelling with two dice, which (excluding snake eyes) is a success. However, the magic phase now continues with your 6PD vs his 2DD - jolly good.

Lot of good outcomes there. With thrall casters your opponent can try the single die dispelling without risking that much, but you seem to know your opponents pretty well, so this might be something to use against those with only one über-caster on their lists.

I didn't even consider using the book multiple times during a single phase, as I don't think my gaming group would allow that.

 

[Lord Fear]

Well, there's another benefit too: it won't necessarily be expected! I am tempted to drop a unit of my Zombies for a Necromancer with the Book... means even in silly games like last night where my Lord died turn 1, I've still got a potent magic phase.

 

[Count Lasombra]

It really is potent.I'm gonna enjoy playing magical chicken with my skeletal jester.
Place opponent in instant pickle on 3+

 

[Rökindja]

ok, they certainly have a use, the outcomes you have mentioned are great, and definitely put your opponent in a position where he has to decide quite fast among several options. it has a psychological effect. but if i am taking a necro, i would go with a scroll. i think it's far more important. ok, you can always put a bound item on your thrall, but then again, there are some better options. i will try out the book/staff

 

[WeakNagash345]

well personally i like necros i dont like the models but i like the whole idea of being some mad man hideing in a cave untill some vampire comes and says im going to kill people and then the necro goes ok ill come and help your armys! then the necro gets killed by konrad...:konrad: lol anyway yh i like necros and i think they are useful
BTW pls check out my new character in necrarch`s workshop