Questions about AoS

[Seneschal]

Hello all

1) Is the game played with open lists?

2) I remember the first edition saying that Tomb Kings and Brettonians could be used but that they wouldn't be supported moving forward. Are TK's still viable or are they so weak that they can't keep up?

3) Do you have to use round bases?

4) Are GW models required?

5) Are Strigoi viable and are they just a push models forward kind of army like a recent youtube video stated?

6) Which faction could you drop a Lahmian vampire into?

7) The video I mentioned said something along the lines of "you could buy 4 of the flesh eater courts starter boxes and have a very solid force." Is this is true?

EDIT 8) Are the Endless Spells minis required?

Thanks for reading and for you help

 

[The Sun King]

Hi Sen!

1) Open as in you know what the opponent is fielding? If so, yes.
2) I haven't played with or against either, but maybe Unas the slayer can enlighten us?
3) only in tournaments, squares are fine for casual gaming.
4) No. Except for GW sanctioned tournaments I would assume.
5) Strigoi has turned into its completely own army called the Flesheater Courts and they are definitely viable and not simple. I really like playing them.
6) Legion of Blood is Neferata's faction. It is the army I swear my allegience to. They also just got a buff to their rules in the newest White Dwarf.
7) yes.
8) not for casual games if you have a proxy that fits the size. Hope that helps Cheers, Sunny

 

[Seneschal]

Many thanks, hero!
Yes, by "open list" I meant can you see what the opponent is fielding. Good to know, good to know...
I'm considering AoS, it's just tough to find an opponent, lol. Everyone here is either Kings of War or the new sci-fi game that is basically a better 40k. It's called Grim Dark Future from onepagerules.
I'll take a look at your guides!

 

[Unas the slayer]

Hi Sen!

2) I have played with or against either, but maybe Unas the slayer can enlighten us?

Years have passed since the last time I've used my TK.
AFAIK you can use them in narrative and open play, but in matched play i don't know if they are still a thing. In official tournaments i don't think, in friendly games it's up to you and your opponent.
All you have to do is to use the latest points value, if you can still find them (wahapedia is your best bet, i think).

the positive things is that those warscrolls are old, so you can probably still have effects that are triggered on modified dice rolls, rather than on "unmodified rolls of 6s"

 

[The Sun King]

Many thanks, hero! Yes, by "open list" I meant can you see what the opponent is fielding. Good to know, good to know... I'm considering AoS, it's just tough to find an opponent, lol. Everyone here is either Kings of War or the new sci-fi game that is basically a better 40k. It's called Grim Dark Future from onepagerules. I'll take a look at your guides!

If you're looking for good YouTube channels with batreps and such I can recommend:

Wargaming Online
Vincent Venturella
AoS Coach
Season of War

 

[Sception]

The issue with Tomb Kings is not that they're 'too weak' to keep up - they've actually still got some quite strong units (necropolis knights), mechanics (recursion banners, especially in multiwound units like necropolis knights), and synergies (exalted chariot, herald, etc, especially when applied to necropolis knights).

The issue is that Tomb Kings are no longer supported. Officially they can't be run at all in matched play games at all, and no longer have official points vallues. Of course, what your local club allows is up to them, and it's not hard to find what their most recent valid points values were. Unfortunately, the lack of active support means those points values haven't been updated to stay in balance, and they're mostly a fair bit higher than they should be, which doesn't help.

More significantly, their warscrolls haven't been updated since first edition. This means a lot of their rules don't really make sense anymore. EG: back in first edition only your general could use command abilities, so the Exalted Chariot's feature that allowed any nearby friendly heroes to use their command abilities was a big deal and a significant part of its very high points cost. Nowadays command abilities are limited by command points, not by the requirement to be your general, so that ability basically does nothing but since points haven't been updated there hasn't been any discount to the exalted chariot to reflect that.

This kind of 'that's not really how things work anymore' issue is a recurring one when dealing with the tomb king rules, and it makes them overall frustrating.

What Tomb Kings really need is a community effort fandom battletome. Unfortunately, there's not a lot of consolidated drive to make one - or at least not in places I frequent. I understand a lot of fandom activity has moved to discord and reddit, and I'm just not active there, so maybe there's some community projects underway that I'm not aware of. Even if there was, though, GW in general is much more aggressive about discouraging these sorts of fan projects lately.


Anyway, if your local scene is cool with it, you can find kind of sort of mostly playable formerly official tomb king rules, and there's enough meat left on those sun bleached bones that you could even win some games with them, but it's a rather frustrating experience. I imagine the situation is the same for brettonians.


If you're starting from scratch, I recommend looking at the Ossiarch Bonereapers instead. Their rules are also a bit clunky and questionably competitive at the moment, but there's a lot of overlapping conceptual ground, and they'll continue to receive support going forward.

 

[Oppenheimer]

Here's the official GW word on base sizes and squares. Obviously you can do whatever you want with your hobby:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/59NHG8W0rPt92WyK.pdf

Also, they haven't updated that document since Jan 2021 so all the Vampire Counts info is outdated.

GW haven't updated their TK and Brets in years but I created a 2e Bretonnian tome

Microsoft OneDrive

1drv.ms

 

[Seneschal]

Many thanks for the info!

Sad to hear about TK's and Bretts but I figured that was the case.

What about the Khorne units like the Bloodsecrator that were in the first starter box? I couldn't find anything about them.

 

[Sception]

I'm not an expert on non-death factions (or even death factions if you want informed opinions on competitive play), but you should find all the Khornate stuff, including original AoS starter box units and heroes, in the 'Blades of Khorne' battletome. IIRC that's a 2e tome, currently fully playable and valid but yet to receive specific updates for 3rd edition.

 

[Oppenheimer]

Totally agree with Sception most tomes are 2e right now and the blades of khorne is the one you want (this is the Canadian link) But, there's a ton of errata to help make them more compatible with 3e. The easiest stuff to find is on GW's errata page

https://www.warhammer-community.com/faqs/#warhammer-age-of-sigmar

There is unfortunately also a bunch of new rules that they have been putting out in White Dwarf over the last few months. It's not super necessary stuff and I don't think Khorne is one of the armies they've done that to, but it's not very cool in my opinion as it's hard to track down.

 

[Seneschal]

So to start what are my essentials? Should I get the expensive Core book or the Getting started with AoS book or should I purchase something else?

edit: can I use any GW vamp model to represent a character?

 

[Sception]

In a home game or independant store, you can use whatever models you want as long as your opponents & the host are ok with it.

In a casual game at a games workshop store, you need to use games workshop models, but whether proxies and counts as with those models us ok is mostly up to your opponent.

At any sort of formal competitive event, your models need to be on the right base size (note: vampire lords are 40mm now, most existing models would need to be rebased), and need to be recognizeable as what unit they are with no confusion. Conversions, even scratch builds can be ok, but straight up proxying one model you could field as another - eg saying 'this regular vampire lord model is Radukar the Wolf' or 'Mannfred is actually Neferata' is generally bad form as it can lead to confusion during the game.

 

[The Sun King]

So to start what are my essentials? Should I get the expensive Core book or the Getting started with AoS book or should I purchase something else?

edit: can I use any GW vamp model to represent a character?

I'll send you a PM with some ideas

 

[Sception]

I'd consider the general's handbook to be essential, it has the core rules & the current rules for matched play, which ime is the favored format for generic bring & battle pick up games. Next is the battletome for your army. You'll also want to check if your army has received expanded faction rules outside of your battletome, for example Nighthaunt got extra rules in the campaign book Broken Realms: Be'lakor and Soulblight Gravelords are getting expanded rules in this month's white dwarf (issue 471).

The big core book is nice and i do reccomend it but it's not essential & quite expensive so it can wait.

That covers rules. Models are another consideration entirely.

 

[Seneschal]

Thanks for the replies!

Could I use a different head on a model and still have it be tournament legal?

Does Arkhan not have his own legion?

 

[Sception]

Arkhan's previous legion, the Legion of Sacrament, is no more. After the reveal of the Ossiarch Bonereapers he had his own servants ground up to make more ossiarchs, and for that sacrifice was gifted command of the Null Myriad subfaction in the Bonereaper book. So yes, Arkhan does still have his own legion, but it isn't in the Soulblight Gravelords book. Sadly Arkhan cannot be fielded with the Gravelords at all anymore.

Re headswaps, weapon swaps, etc. They're almost always fine. Just so long as they don't make it unclear what unit/warscroll the model represents.

 

[The Sun King]

Also Arkhan is dead (in the books). But trust me, he will return - he always does.

 

[Seneschal]

"DIE WELL, MY SERVANT"

Yeah, he certainly does

 

[Seneschal]

-Say I want to field Legion of Blood like a good little Lahmian but I want to include a varghulf as the model has always been a favorite of mine. Can this be done and are there any synergies the 'ghulf can benefit from?

-Is 2000 points the standard?

-what is considered the "low" standard? 750?

 

[El Syf]

-Say I want to field Legion of Blood like a good little Lahmian but I want to include a varghulf as the model has always been a favorite of mine. Can this be done and are there any synergies the 'ghulf can benefit from?

-Is 2000 points the standard?

-what is considered the "low" standard? 750?

2000 is considered standard game size, not too sure on low standard.
Varghulf you would have to ally in and would not benefit from any of the allegiance abilities.
You could always use the model as the thing with a similar name from the cursed city box though? Depending on how easy going your opponents are.

 

[The Sun King]

Yeah the standard games are 1000 points and 2000 points. 2k is what most tournies run. You can use the Varghulf model and just use the Vargskyr warscroll from our battletome. It doesn't have much synergy but is a decent Lone Wolf.

 

[Seneschal]

Thanks for the replies

-How many points can I get out of the Soulblight Battleforce?

-How many points can I get out of the Flesh Eater starter?

-What are the first recommended upgrades for each? (I love varghulfs btw)

-Is it worth it to buy the basic Stormcast vs. X box set or am I ok with going the vampire route?

 

[The Sun King]

Thanks for the replies -How many points can I get out of the Soulblight Battleforce? -How many points can I get out of the Flesh Eater starter? -What are the first recommended upgrades for each? (I love varghulfs btw) -Is it worth it to buy the basic Stormcast vs. X box set or am I ok with going the vampire route?

The Soulblight Battleforce is 875 points.

The FEC starter set is 815 points if you build it as: Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon, three Vargheists, 10 ghouls (that you can take as allies) and then from the spare Ghoul King convert a Vampire Lord on foot. I'm not 100% sure that you can do this so you would have to check the sprues. I wouldn't recommend buying the FEC starter unless you want to run a Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon.

To answer your third question I would have to know are you going Soulblight or FEC? And are you aiming for a 2000 pts list? If so then I would get some Dire Wolves, a Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon, a Vampire Lord on foot, and 20 graveguard.

I am unsure why you would buy the Stormcast box as it doesn't contain any undead?

 

[Seneschal]

Sorry I need to be more in depth with my questions.

-I meant how many points of a FEC list can I get from the FEC starter. I'm trying to plan ahead if I can get someone to try the game out so I'll have FEC and Blood Legion.

-The Stormcast question- I was just wondering if it's better to start off with a basic rules set box then start collecting vampires afterwards. I'm guessing no.

Edit:- Great weapons on the GG?

Thanks for your patience, friend!

 

[Oppenheimer]

Edit:- Great weapons on the GG?

Thanks for your patience, friend!

Yes, with the +1 save cap shields are a terrible investment.