Skeleton shields

[dongilles]

This comes from the skeleton warriors warscroll:

Crypt Shield: You can add 1 to save rolls for a unit carrying Crypt Shields against attacks that have a Rend of ‘-'

Does this means that the shield only works agains units with no rend? That would make shields pretty useless

 

[Borgnine]

I think it reflects the fact, that skeletons' shields are old, rusted and brittle and while they will stop something light, they will shatter against anyone serious. If your skellies will face goblins, that's not that bad

 

[Demian]

Consider this:

Skeletons can replenish D6 models each turn.

Therefore, they are made more fragile than other armies's "basic" troops, however they can do battle just at the same level as other basic models with their stats (4+ to Hit & Wound for everything, 5+ to Hit with spears, but fighting with an extra model).

Most basic troops possess a 6+ Save with some gimmick to make them feel not so weak (+1 Saves in the Combat Phase, for instance, etc). So we stand the same as others.

If any troop with any Rend wishes to clash against skeletons, they're going to have a bad time against our actual armored units, since Skeletons are there to form a line, hold it and dish out pain, thin their numbers, hold them in place, etc. It is not a very good idea to crash an elite unit against skeletons anyway, so that disadvantage shouldn't be too great a concern.

=D

 

[Oppenheimer]

The real question is does Neferata's spell which allows a unit to ignore rend make the shields always work?

 

[Demian]

I... would assume it does, however that should be included in the AoS Faqs somehow, or at least, re-word it so it becomes more clear

 

[Irisado]

The utility of Crypt shields is rather army dependent. I found the shields quite useful against some of the lower level Daemon units I faced which did not have a rend bonus. They're definitely a unit that's supposed to hold up the opposition and so using them as a blocker against lower level opposing units is how I think they are best used. They're not really that great an offensive unit after all.

 

[Sception]

Our shields are relatively terrible, yes. Tomb Kings tomb shields are a lot better, which make tomb guard a superior choice to grave guard if you're looking for a sturdier infantry block. Most of the units stuck with crypt shields are still good, though - fragile, but recursive, hurty, and with access to stackable buffs. The only crypt shield unit that I find not to be worth the time is, sadly, our black knights, whose attacks are too weak and too few to really hurt anything, and whose defense is so poor that they still melt under any attention at all, especially from anything with rend, so they're not going to hold anything up, either. With their once signature ability to walk through walls removed they're no longer especially mobile, and I've seen units of black knights out fought by war machine crews.

But for skeletons or grave guard? They're there to hurt things, and if an enemy's blade happens to get stuck in one of their rotting shields now and then, that's just gravy.

 

[Oppenheimer]

I... would assume it does, however that should be included in the AoS Faqs somehow, or at least, re-word it so it becomes more clear

I posted on the AoS Facebook page the question but there's been no response from GW.

 

[The Sun King]

I would say no as Neferata's spell doesn't change the actual wording on the weapon being used.

 

[Woolly.Mammoth]

All armies have unique shield properties. Undead shields suck, its just how it is. Luckily it makes the decision whether to take it easy, as the case with Grave Guard. I do wish blood shields were better. The Ancient shield is great but its only for WK and a Lord on Terror.

The rule specifically reads that the attack must have a rend of "-". When you look at a warscroll, the Rend column either has a "-" or a negative number. If an attack has a Rend of -1, then its rend is -1, even if you are ignoring the rend, its rend is not "-". By logic, Neferata cannot improve shields and by fluff terms, she is making them ethereal and so I guess you can say she is making them even worse.

The ability to heal and regen is amazingly potent in AoS, and is now guaranteed for most things instead of tied to a spell your opponent can unbind (or kill your wizard). So our shields suck but it doesn't really matter.

 

[Ust66]

I gave my Skeleton Warriors Spears because the shields aren't very good, I'll take the extra range to get more attacks in. I also split my grave guard so that I use the great blades against armies with rend and the shields to use against armies with no rend.

 

[Sception]

But... skeletons with spears have shields, too?

 

[Infernal Skull]

This comes from the skeleton warriors warscroll:

Crypt Shield: You can add 1 to save rolls for a unit carrying Crypt Shields against attacks that have a Rend of ‘-'

Does this means that the shield only works agains units with no rend? That would make shields pretty useless

To answer the OP's question: All Skeleton Warriors have shields, either Crypt Shields or Tomb Shields. Both of those confer a basic 6+ save (as indicated on the warscroll in the "save" bracket). Crypt Shields let you add one to save rolls against attacks with no Rend, which effectively bumps the 6+ save to a 5+. Tomb Shields let you add one to save rolls if you don't run or charge, effectively bumps the 6+ save to a 5+ (and that's regardless of Rend).

As for the usefulness, you'll always get a 6+ save, but can add 1 to the roll depending on the circumstances and which type of shield you took.

 

[Demian]

I must serve correction:

our (former Vampire Counts's) Skeleton Warriors no longer have the Tomb Shield option in the Grand Alliance of Death book / products.

Only the Tomb Kings version of them have (and they are identical otherwise). However with the new General's Handbook coming into play, this distinction, can present a problem if, for instance, you are trying to get Allegiance bonuses and want to field Tomb King Skeleton Warriors while attemting to fullfill a Death rattle Horde battallion's minimum units.

just something to consider

 

[Infernal Skull]

I must serve correction:

our (former Vampire Counts's) Skeleton Warriors no longer have the Tomb Shield option in the Grand Alliance of Death book / products.

Only the Tomb Kings version of them have (and they are identical otherwise). However with the new General's Handbook coming into play, this distinction, can present a problem if, for instance, you are trying to get Allegiance bonuses and want to field Tomb King Skeleton Warriors while attemting to fullfill a Death rattle Horde battallion's minimum units.

just something to consider

Okay, I didn't know there had been a change in the unit with regard to shield types. Still, the Skeleton's basic save should be listed as 6+ and then you can add 1 to the save roll when saving against units with no Rend. So, the shields aren't useless, they just get better if the attacker doesn't have Rend.

 

[Sception]

subfaction allegiance bonuses mostly aren't worth trying for regardless. The deathrattle bonus only gets you black knights as a battle line unit. Black knights aren't a very impressive unit, and if you're fielding a Deathrattle horde you've probably met your battle line requirement anyway.