Hey guys I will be playing against khorne daemons either this week or next. There will most likely be a blood thirster and there will definitely be a bunch of blood crushers. There may or may not be a skull cannon, I'm honestly not sure
Tips vs khorne daemons
- Thread starter estwheadn
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How many points?
-a VL built for combat with OTS will make daemons cry.
-Nightshroud will be helpful against a BT.
-watch out for ambushing hounds. They pack a punch and have high magic resistance.
-bloodletters are expensive but fragile. Some players take them in one big unit in which case you should just tarpit them with fifty zombies and keep summoning.
-the crushers don't have the great armor they used but can still pack a punch. I don't remember their stats but I think they can be dealt with by Archai. Running hexwraiths through them could also be a viable option. I would try to hit them with Dance to get the most out if their soul strider ability.
-mark of Khorne gives them +1 strength on any turn in which they charge. This means that if they overrun they will not have the increased strength the following turn. Make sure your opponent understands that.
-a VL built for combat with OTS will make daemons cry.
-Nightshroud will be helpful against a BT.
-watch out for ambushing hounds. They pack a punch and have high magic resistance.
-bloodletters are expensive but fragile. Some players take them in one big unit in which case you should just tarpit them with fifty zombies and keep summoning.
-the crushers don't have the great armor they used but can still pack a punch. I don't remember their stats but I think they can be dealt with by Archai. Running hexwraiths through them could also be a viable option. I would try to hit them with Dance to get the most out if their soul strider ability.
-mark of Khorne gives them +1 strength on any turn in which they charge. This means that if they overrun they will not have the increased strength the following turn. Make sure your opponent understands that.
- Crypt Horrors WRECK bloodletters.
- Khorne has good magic resistance so damage spells is not the best against. Go with raise dead and the like instead.
- Chances are that he will bring Frenzied units, find them and redirect them over the board (they MUST overrun).
- Drop ethereals as everything has magical attacks.
- Use scenarios to your advantage. You get models back he doesn't. This means that watch tower is a really good scenario for us.
- Khorne has good magic resistance so damage spells is not the best against. Go with raise dead and the like instead.
- Chances are that he will bring Frenzied units, find them and redirect them over the board (they MUST overrun).
- Drop ethereals as everything has magical attacks.
- Use scenarios to your advantage. You get models back he doesn't. This means that watch tower is a really good scenario for us.
jbizzle113
Ghoul
Hexwraiths are awesome against everything as long as they avoid the khannons and do not engaged. Only do run throughs.
Apply leadership penalties as often as you can when engaged. Daemons lose more models based on their leadership being lower.
Forbidden Lore Light council is very effective as is Lore of Vampires.
You want to use redirection against khorne as they are useless if they can't charge reliably. This means though the flyers and khannons are the most threatening elements.
Screams are effective. As is anything that dishes out poison, including ghouls and skeleton archers with Khalida, in addition to the crypt horrors as Sunny mentioned. Use Book of Arkhan to get Van Hel's in to your army if you aren't using lore of vampires. Take as a back up even if you are. Van Hel's let's your poison combat units cause more poison wounds.
Apply leadership penalties as often as you can when engaged. Daemons lose more models based on their leadership being lower.
Forbidden Lore Light council is very effective as is Lore of Vampires.
You want to use redirection against khorne as they are useless if they can't charge reliably. This means though the flyers and khannons are the most threatening elements.
Screams are effective. As is anything that dishes out poison, including ghouls and skeleton archers with Khalida, in addition to the crypt horrors as Sunny mentioned. Use Book of Arkhan to get Van Hel's in to your army if you aren't using lore of vampires. Take as a back up even if you are. Van Hel's let's your poison combat units cause more poison wounds.
Etherals against daemons is quite a risk - everything have magical attacks, and we dont run - so hexies will be at the mercy of some fast or even flying killer and they end up as very costly drop.
Leadership penalties are good. Screams are very good. Crypt horrors are excellent against blodletters.
Debuffs, espetially debuffing WS,I and S can cripple them. Also, debuffs ignoring MR. Frenzy is sometimes avoided but it happends in Khorne army. If something has it, it can be redirected and finished from the flank.
Good combo of killy units can sort them out - dont expect the gunline from daemon army so flyers and big monsters can be more playable (terrorgheists, VL on ZD, and other). Frenzy and redirecting - i seened Khorne daemon army without single frenzied model, so it can be situational, but if there will be, mark where it is, redirect and enforce that oveerun and take his flank.
Remember about Reign of Chaos table - only 3 rolls are good for them, and +1 ward or deploying new unit is not big hurt so it dont have big impact on the game. Daemonic possesion can be painful for us, but can be minimized by Ld10 and BSB. The rest are bad for daemons or they will be have no effect on the battle but as their units and characters are expensive, one punishment can be decisive.
Leadership penalties are good. Screams are very good. Crypt horrors are excellent against blodletters.
Debuffs, espetially debuffing WS,I and S can cripple them. Also, debuffs ignoring MR. Frenzy is sometimes avoided but it happends in Khorne army. If something has it, it can be redirected and finished from the flank.
Good combo of killy units can sort them out - dont expect the gunline from daemon army so flyers and big monsters can be more playable (terrorgheists, VL on ZD, and other). Frenzy and redirecting - i seened Khorne daemon army without single frenzied model, so it can be situational, but if there will be, mark where it is, redirect and enforce that oveerun and take his flank.
Remember about Reign of Chaos table - only 3 rolls are good for them, and +1 ward or deploying new unit is not big hurt so it dont have big impact on the game. Daemonic possesion can be painful for us, but can be minimized by Ld10 and BSB. The rest are bad for daemons or they will be have no effect on the battle but as their units and characters are expensive, one punishment can be decisive.
Honestly the biggest threat in a khorne demon army will be the cannons, demon princes, and bloodthirster. Cannons you either need to take care of quickly, or build a lists that won't be too bothered by them.
Screams can take out the DP or Great Demon, a tooled up VL could also do rather well. One thing to keep in mind, though scary the Demon Army doesn't have high saves, so a lot of low strength attacks over a period of time can bring down the 'Thirster or DP. Take champions in every unit you can, so as to challenge out the big scary guys to buy you extra rounds.
My personal suggestion try to tie up the DP/ 'THirster, gun for the other points. Blood Crushers put out a decent amount of attacks but have no staying power due to low armor saves. Bloodletters are as squishy as elves. These are your "easy" points. Keep in mind bloodcrushers and blood letters have killing blow.
Khorne demons will almost never be frenzied. The only way for them to frenzy is with a special character, which also frenzies you, or with a herald taking an over pointed loci, which doesn't often happen. If you do run into a loci running herald, just kill the herald but regulating attacks on it, boom, problem solved.
I agree with Najo that poison attacks will do well. I also would rate the Hexwraiths, the most maneuverable things in the army are the characters, avoid them and the cannons you should be able to continually run through the support stuff to devastating effect.
One last piece of advice, don't send your Vampire out of a unit if at all possible, the Reign of Chaos table targets each unit not in combat, and inevitably the turn your Vamp is on its own it will get hit and killed by something! Plus cannons lol!
Good luck
Screams can take out the DP or Great Demon, a tooled up VL could also do rather well. One thing to keep in mind, though scary the Demon Army doesn't have high saves, so a lot of low strength attacks over a period of time can bring down the 'Thirster or DP. Take champions in every unit you can, so as to challenge out the big scary guys to buy you extra rounds.
My personal suggestion try to tie up the DP/ 'THirster, gun for the other points. Blood Crushers put out a decent amount of attacks but have no staying power due to low armor saves. Bloodletters are as squishy as elves. These are your "easy" points. Keep in mind bloodcrushers and blood letters have killing blow.
Khorne demons will almost never be frenzied. The only way for them to frenzy is with a special character, which also frenzies you, or with a herald taking an over pointed loci, which doesn't often happen. If you do run into a loci running herald, just kill the herald but regulating attacks on it, boom, problem solved.
I agree with Najo that poison attacks will do well. I also would rate the Hexwraiths, the most maneuverable things in the army are the characters, avoid them and the cannons you should be able to continually run through the support stuff to devastating effect.
One last piece of advice, don't send your Vampire out of a unit if at all possible, the Reign of Chaos table targets each unit not in combat, and inevitably the turn your Vamp is on its own it will get hit and killed by something! Plus cannons lol!
Good luck
To add to what's been said. The reign of chaos table can be mititgated by smart engagements since it only effects unengaged units. So, don't necessarily rush to engage, but the sooner you are the less checks for the table you are subjected to.