Any one else used them? I took 2 last night and screamed off a steam tank that charged one of them the other took out 2 empire demigriph things but died after being charged, for the points 190 I think they done ok..
tomb banshee
- Thread starter sn33r
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Minty
Grave Guard
I've never regretted taking them. When ever I do, I take at least two, sometimes three.
They are in some ways a microcosm of the way I play VC - an array of funky tricks. Yes, only tricks and gimmicks, but they reward cleverness in a very satisfying way.
They are in some ways a microcosm of the way I play VC - an array of funky tricks. Yes, only tricks and gimmicks, but they reward cleverness in a very satisfying way.
The look on my mates face when I didn't turn up with my tbats then scream him off the board.. I thought he was going to cry..
Screams are fantastic and overrated at the same time.
They can do insane damage to certain targets, but ONLY to certain targets, and the 2d6 roll is incredibly swingy.
They need to hit high armor/toughness targets. Both Banshees and Terrorgheists are very expensive and very fragile. They won't last long enough to fully grind down infantry blocks, but they can potentially devastate war machines, knights, moncav, and priority targets like Demon Princes.
Banshees are rarely worth it to me, since an average roll for them does 0 wounds against a LD 9 unit (which, with Inspiring Presence, is most things). A nearly 100 point hero needs to not rely that much on luck.
They can do insane damage to certain targets, but ONLY to certain targets, and the 2d6 roll is incredibly swingy.
They need to hit high armor/toughness targets. Both Banshees and Terrorgheists are very expensive and very fragile. They won't last long enough to fully grind down infantry blocks, but they can potentially devastate war machines, knights, moncav, and priority targets like Demon Princes.
Banshees are rarely worth it to me, since an average roll for them does 0 wounds against a LD 9 unit (which, with Inspiring Presence, is most things). A nearly 100 point hero needs to not rely that much on luck.
It´s true that they rely very much on the luck (2d6), RarerMonsters; but for me that´s indeed one of their BEST things they have: the menace, the threat.
Of course, matematically they usually won´t do anything against most of the units inside general´s bubble, but the opponent can´t think that way, because... what if i roll an 11 or a 12?. The crazy ladies scare with the POTENTIAL of what they can do.
Of course, matematically they usually won´t do anything against most of the units inside general´s bubble, but the opponent can´t think that way, because... what if i roll an 11 or a 12?. The crazy ladies scare with the POTENTIAL of what they can do.
Good observations RarerMonsters. There is more to it than just saying that Banshees don't do any wounds on average though. First off YOU get to pick the targets, this is really important since you don't target low profile high ld models. You pick off stuff that's outside IP and/or expensive. Secondly there are several solid ways to lower the enemy Ld to make the screams more effective (for instance AoDM and Doom and Darkness). Thirdly I would say that it's more interesting to say it this way: Against a ld 9 unit there is just below 50% chance to cause a wound. Just see it as if you combined to hit and to wound in one roll - does that make sense?
Anywho, I really like Banshees and tournament players do as well
The reason for this (vs the Tbat) is that they can hide in units and form an ethereal wall :konrad:
Anywho, I really like Banshees and tournament players do as well
The reason for this (vs the Tbat) is that they can hide in units and form an ethereal wall :konrad:
The synergies people always talk about Tomb Banshees don't really do much for me, mainly because they only compound the problems I already have with it.
Warhammer isn't a game about Synergy, it's about maneuvering to maximize the odds.
Take a few of these synergies:
Ethereal Wall: More expensive than Wraiths, which will already eat up your hero points, this "wall" bleeds about 300 points to a 5 point item.
Worse, using banshees to wall off a unit drastically reduces their mobility, keeping them away from the right targets.
Aura of Dark Majesty: Taking this on any vampire is a concession, because it means going without RF+QB on a VL or either on a Hero. Even on an SGK, you're getting one extra wound per turn out of it, if your Vamp is in close range. Screams are good at taking down siege engines, moncav, and flying daemons, things which should not be both near your lord and alive.
Doom and Darkness: You're casting a spell to do 3 wounds. Just buy a Necro and Deathsnipe.
Banshees definitely aren't useless, I just tend to think they're too vulnerable with no save. You can really only count on 1 turn alive with them, and they lack the manueverability of the Tbat or its killing reliability. Take them, try them, maybe they'll work for you, but in the meantime I'm going to keep my spooky girlfriend in the foam.
Warhammer isn't a game about Synergy, it's about maneuvering to maximize the odds.
Take a few of these synergies:
Ethereal Wall: More expensive than Wraiths, which will already eat up your hero points, this "wall" bleeds about 300 points to a 5 point item.
Worse, using banshees to wall off a unit drastically reduces their mobility, keeping them away from the right targets.
Aura of Dark Majesty: Taking this on any vampire is a concession, because it means going without RF+QB on a VL or either on a Hero. Even on an SGK, you're getting one extra wound per turn out of it, if your Vamp is in close range. Screams are good at taking down siege engines, moncav, and flying daemons, things which should not be both near your lord and alive.
Doom and Darkness: You're casting a spell to do 3 wounds. Just buy a Necro and Deathsnipe.
Banshees definitely aren't useless, I just tend to think they're too vulnerable with no save. You can really only count on 1 turn alive with them, and they lack the manueverability of the Tbat or its killing reliability. Take them, try them, maybe they'll work for you, but in the meantime I'm going to keep my spooky girlfriend in the foam.
good points raremonsters except if you have more than one banshee the extra wounds you get from doom and darkness and aodm increase makeing the investment more worthwhile , not to mention the tg and me screams you may have in the list.
also if you add a banshee to say a skellie unit does the unit then cause terror or does the majority of the unit need to cause terror.
This doesn't work as the lore of death targets individual characters, a banshees scream is designed to kill the unit. -3ld is 3 more +1 AS knights dead a turn, which is something a lot of our other units would struggle to achieve. The return becomes even greater with multiple banshees and AotDM
sn33r said:
I've tried them a few times (along with a Skabscrath, CotR and AoDM SGK), but have never been particularly impressed. Although, admittedly, they at least performed better than the Ghoul King - who might as well have been armed with a bubble-gun, for all the good Skabscrath did.
The problems I have are:
1) I just don't seem to face armies with enough elite units to justify screams - especially banshee ones. Usually, a terrorgheist will be far more useful (and including both a terrorgheist and some banshees would be overkill).
2) I often play high elves, and said player always uses the BotWD - which renders my screams (and most of my army, for that matter) worthless.
3) I often face DoC - which are already better than me in combat, rely on ward saves rather than armour and effortlessly kill ethereal units with anything in their army.
So, maybe it's just my meta, but I find banshees really hard to justify.
The brilliant thing with Banshees is also their mobility. They have all the nice tactical options as Wriaths but gets a scream as well... not bad by any rate.
Vipoid said:
I've thought about this a lot. Is this kind of resistance common enough to include some form of semi death star that rely only on physical attacks?
Like unaugmented BK blocks or a blender/miniblender without a magic weapon.
Blender without a magic wep
I use this build.
VL LvL 4
GW
HA
Nightshroud
TOP
OTS
Begile
Quickblood
RF
Nightmare(Barded)
SO you have a 2+ 4+ save, strike in initiative order, give your opponent always strike last and remove strength bonuses. You can still get your rerolls from LoV or you could just equip with a lance espicially if your just fighting pointy ears.
I use this build.
VL LvL 4
GW
HA
Nightshroud
TOP
OTS
Begile
Quickblood
RF
Nightmare(Barded)
SO you have a 2+ 4+ save, strike in initiative order, give your opponent always strike last and remove strength bonuses. You can still get your rerolls from LoV or you could just equip with a lance espicially if your just fighting pointy ears.
SGK without magic weapon is viable in low points games. Just give him RF and let him go to town.
Lord Astaroth
Zombie
I like to have one floating around the game board and have found that they are useful against lone monsters like slaughterbrutes. Plus on a 2d6 +2 against low ld armies you may get a wound or two but it's also fairly quick and can provide a flank charge if it's being used to support another unit and don't forget it causes terror. Having it go against the right untis or even helping support another unit in combat the next few games the opponent should realise that it has the potential to be deadly. When against ogres I had a squad of 9 ogre bulls reform to prevent themselves being flanked by it giving enough time for Krell and his skeleton squad to flank them and cause them to flee.
All in all it depends on how you use them, many opponents won't give lone banshees much heed if they're unsure of what they're capable of. You can provide flanking support to other units, force the opponent to reform themselves and hunt lone monsters. But it can also go drastically wrong when you throw 95pts at a single model and have it do nothing in a game or die by turn 1-2.
All in all it depends on how you use them, many opponents won't give lone banshees much heed if they're unsure of what they're capable of. You can provide flanking support to other units, force the opponent to reform themselves and hunt lone monsters. But it can also go drastically wrong when you throw 95pts at a single model and have it do nothing in a game or die by turn 1-2.