Vampire counts army book? your changes.
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krisbot4000
Skeleton
Skeletons should be about 3 points a model with light armor and hand weapons with options for shields, halberds, spears and additional hand weapon and possibly morning stars or flails (are there any infantry that uses morning stars?) and possibly heavy armor (thinking of blood knights having the smaller, more elite army of wights, short of making GG core which is way unbalanced, giving skeletons heavy armor is the best way to do this)
Ghouls should be 5-6 points and changed to skirmishers, devastating charge would be cool but thats just wish listing.
Zombies should keep most of their stats the same but raise to T3 with regen (6+)
speaking of wish listing live troops would be characterful as long as it were limited to halberdiers, spearmen, militia and archers and/or crossbowmen. Vampires shouldn't get empire artillery, even with it being a territory I feel like they wouldn't have access to that.
The levy troops could have some restriction on them, maybe can have as many units of levy troops as you have of another undead foot core unit. Maybe decrease the base leadership to 6 instead of the empire's 7.
This would give skeletons and ghouls a distinct difference. Ghouls now have to rely solely on kills but are still very potent at doing so. Skeletons would be good anvils who could be kitted to dish out some pain as well.
Our specials and rare are pretty good as are. Feel like our core needs help the most.
Ghouls should be 5-6 points and changed to skirmishers, devastating charge would be cool but thats just wish listing.
Zombies should keep most of their stats the same but raise to T3 with regen (6+)
speaking of wish listing live troops would be characterful as long as it were limited to halberdiers, spearmen, militia and archers and/or crossbowmen. Vampires shouldn't get empire artillery, even with it being a territory I feel like they wouldn't have access to that.
The levy troops could have some restriction on them, maybe can have as many units of levy troops as you have of another undead foot core unit. Maybe decrease the base leadership to 6 instead of the empire's 7.
This would give skeletons and ghouls a distinct difference. Ghouls now have to rely solely on kills but are still very potent at doing so. Skeletons would be good anvils who could be kitted to dish out some pain as well.
Our specials and rare are pretty good as are. Feel like our core needs help the most.
I entirely agree on that point – Skellies and Ghouls should be made different enough, to fulfil two roles. Ghouls for offense, skellies for defense. I don’t think skellies should have access to too much equipment – that should be an option for wights (two hand weapons for wights would be fun).
So for Skellies I think options should be Heavy Armour, spears……maybe Halberds.
Interesting though on Zombies with regen. I would much prefer for zombies to be the classic hard to kill dead. So really poor offensively, I would be fine with WS1, S1. I1 etc, but something that makes them a really nasty tarpit.
So for Skellies I think options should be Heavy Armour, spears……maybe Halberds.
Interesting though on Zombies with regen. I would much prefer for zombies to be the classic hard to kill dead. So really poor offensively, I would be fine with WS1, S1. I1 etc, but something that makes them a really nasty tarpit.
Only the most elite units in warhammer have access to heavy armour or better. To give this to an army who not only can heal itself but cannot be broken and cause fear, have access to a fantastic set of abilities, magic and items is a mockery to the more elite units out there who have to pay a lot of point for it and cannot get back onto their feet. Unless you have heavy armour at +4-5 points per model of course. Also, if skeletons got GWs I'd never take anyhting else, sure, grave guard are tougher but harder to raise and while you're stuck in my GW wielding tarpits I'll have to listen to my banshees. When considering weapon options it is good to look at things from the perspective on the entire game, not just "what is fluffy" because the fluff is often misleading(just think about how each race's heroes are portrayed... If the fluff rang true we'd have a great battles of chuck norris clones).
It is only a core unit we're talking about there after all, and we're not Warriors of Chaos. A more sensible change would be upping the cost of Ghouls. Something like, +1 to ghouls -1 to skeletons.
It is only a core unit we're talking about there after all, and we're not Warriors of Chaos. A more sensible change would be upping the cost of Ghouls. Something like, +1 to ghouls -1 to skeletons.
I dont know Mad Larkin, your suggestions seem to be turning our book into a massive powerhouse which really isnt required.
Ghouls are fine at the moment, in fact the biggest problem with them is that offensively they are so much better than Skeletons who are the same points values and are traditionally viewed as being the true core of an undead force. Reducing their points cost and giving them the skirmishers rules would make them really broken.
Skeletons are rather rubbish at the moment but I dont believe them to be 3 points worth of rubbish. Whilst the points value we pay for them is excessive I dont believe its over 50% too much. Shaving a few points off is probably whats needed rather than bringing them to gobbo costing. The fear is less impressive but with light armour and shield they are still resiliant, making them tougher or somehow more survivable through some other means would be nice however cutting their cost by half is just too much.
Giving them heavy armour is a bit much as well, they are core after all and in the current rule set we only have to invest 25% in core. If heavy armoured skeletons are really required you can spend up to 50% of your points on Grave Guard, which are better in every way. I personally feel that skeletons just need to be slightly cheaper than Ghouls, not made much better because they are afterall just reanimated bones.
Ghouls are fine at the moment, in fact the biggest problem with them is that offensively they are so much better than Skeletons who are the same points values and are traditionally viewed as being the true core of an undead force. Reducing their points cost and giving them the skirmishers rules would make them really broken.
Skeletons are rather rubbish at the moment but I dont believe them to be 3 points worth of rubbish. Whilst the points value we pay for them is excessive I dont believe its over 50% too much. Shaving a few points off is probably whats needed rather than bringing them to gobbo costing. The fear is less impressive but with light armour and shield they are still resiliant, making them tougher or somehow more survivable through some other means would be nice however cutting their cost by half is just too much.
Giving them heavy armour is a bit much as well, they are core after all and in the current rule set we only have to invest 25% in core. If heavy armoured skeletons are really required you can spend up to 50% of your points on Grave Guard, which are better in every way. I personally feel that skeletons just need to be slightly cheaper than Ghouls, not made much better because they are afterall just reanimated bones.
I'm more of a fluffy player, and it irritates me to no end that even though in GW recognized Novels Vampire Counts use Bone Catapults, we have no options for ranged weapons.
So, I'd throw in ranged weaponry ( like catapults, or cannons), options for a Zombie Giant, and some normal living troops, like Strigany Gypsies. I'd also very much like to see a return of Bloodlines, and some more characters, like Jerek Von Carstein and the Red Duke. Maybe bring back Heinrich Kimmler, and Neferata as well.
So, I'd throw in ranged weaponry ( like catapults, or cannons), options for a Zombie Giant, and some normal living troops, like Strigany Gypsies. I'd also very much like to see a return of Bloodlines, and some more characters, like Jerek Von Carstein and the Red Duke. Maybe bring back Heinrich Kimmler, and Neferata as well.
Oh yes, I would love to see good old Heinrich come back as well, he was also one of my favourite VC characters.
I'd love to see some sort of vampire infantry; basically Blood Knights on foot. Or, even better, the option to have a "vampire infantry" unit for each of the bloodlines? So Blood Knights on foot, Strigoi infantry, Lahmian guard, a spellcaster unit of Necrarchs, von Carstein just basic averageness. It would be awesome.
But not as awesome as them all being PLASTIC as well as Blood Knights being PLASTIC and NOT £10 each.
Also, make a Zombie Dragon a viable option again; make it so it doesn't count towards Lord choice points or something. Then you might actually see a couple here and there.
And, like has been said, cheaper skellies and better skellies and tougher zombies, the option for basic wargear for our poor vampires, make Vlad non-naked (nigh on indestructible, as described by the book, yet without an armour save...) and bring us more special characters, like the Red Duke etc.
Or even Abhorash? We have Vlad, why not some other master vampires? I hadn't thought of that; when pondering the possibility of GW including Abhorash, I always thought: "no, he's a master, too strong," yet there is Vlad, plain as anything! Bring us Abhorash!!!
/manic pleading
So after that mini-rant, I think I've covered some points. The only problem is a lot of it is too big, too optimistic (such as a plastic kit for each bloodline's elite vampire infantry) some of it is slightly hopeful (rules and a model for Abhorash) some a bit obvious (armour for Vlad) and some just plain requests that we should be granted (cheaper and tougher skellies, tougher zombies, mundane wargear for vampires). All in all, I think we need that boost. Perhaps other areas will fall, but we need that.
Oh, and also:
BLOODLINES!!!
But not as awesome as them all being PLASTIC as well as Blood Knights being PLASTIC and NOT £10 each.
Also, make a Zombie Dragon a viable option again; make it so it doesn't count towards Lord choice points or something. Then you might actually see a couple here and there.
And, like has been said, cheaper skellies and better skellies and tougher zombies, the option for basic wargear for our poor vampires, make Vlad non-naked (nigh on indestructible, as described by the book, yet without an armour save...) and bring us more special characters, like the Red Duke etc.
Or even Abhorash? We have Vlad, why not some other master vampires? I hadn't thought of that; when pondering the possibility of GW including Abhorash, I always thought: "no, he's a master, too strong," yet there is Vlad, plain as anything! Bring us Abhorash!!!
/manic pleading
So after that mini-rant, I think I've covered some points. The only problem is a lot of it is too big, too optimistic (such as a plastic kit for each bloodline's elite vampire infantry) some of it is slightly hopeful (rules and a model for Abhorash) some a bit obvious (armour for Vlad) and some just plain requests that we should be granted (cheaper and tougher skellies, tougher zombies, mundane wargear for vampires). All in all, I think we need that boost. Perhaps other areas will fall, but we need that.
Oh, and also:
BLOODLINES!!!
I think that since we don't get to shoot we should at least have a full arsenal of the other troop types;Monstrous infantry(flesh golems),Fast cavalry-I'd give Black knights this trait,and skirmishers(non-ethereal)-ghouls IMHO are way cooler as skirmishers.I think GW made them rank up as a marketing scheme to sell hella ghouls.
plus,breaking them up would give skellies their job back.
SCOUTS.Giving bat swarms the ability to scout would kill 2 birds with one stone,by giving us a new tactical option whilst simultaneously validating the existance of a unit that blows like a common flathrag on payday.
I'd give zombies 5+ regen.
Bring back bloodlines and give each bloodline it's own base stat template and options that are appropriate to it.
Give dire wolves frenzy :devil2:
plus,breaking them up would give skellies their job back.
SCOUTS.Giving bat swarms the ability to scout would kill 2 birds with one stone,by giving us a new tactical option whilst simultaneously validating the existance of a unit that blows like a common flathrag on payday.
I'd give zombies 5+ regen.
Bring back bloodlines and give each bloodline it's own base stat template and options that are appropriate to it.
Give dire wolves frenzy :devil2:
If all of you want the old Bloodlines back thats fine, just make it so not every vampire needs to be in that bloodline. If they make daemon armies need to mostly mix and match daemon troops, then let Bloodlines do the same. Why can't a Blood Dragon lead the troops and have a caster vamp in the back (forget the name).
Personally I would like to see more lords and hero's. Including a couple 650 point named charicters that can cause havok and go toe to toe with a DoC lord and not be sure who will win. Also two generic vamps in each Lord and Hero selection would be nice, that way we can correctly choose the best point values we have open. Also make our dragons more worth while. S2 breath weapon and 5+ Scaly is just sad for the points.
Core: Let Dire Wolves/Corpse Carts/Bat Swarms could to 25% of our basic core needed. Drop Skellie points to 5 and give a 5+ ward because most attacks on them shouldn't cause harm (i.e. a blow to the ribs wouldn't do crap, kind of like in D&D skellies take half damage vs blades). Zombies 2 points each, When ever a zombie does a wound, on a 5+ a new zombie joins the unit. Dire Wolves +1 attack and Str on charge. Ghouls, 6 or 7 points. Corpse Cart, make that ASF spell like the old bound spell, costs no dice but can be dispelled. Bat Swarms, drop price and make it so they don't suffer combat res.
Special: GG, drop down to 8-10 points each, add option to give full plate and option for flales. BK's, drop cost to 18 points, make barding 2 points, and option to make light cav with no barding. Fel Bats, consider T4, not sure. Spirit hosts, maybe make a bit cheaper.
Rare: Blood knights, base cost 45 points, option to give full plate. Drop Cairn Wraith price some.
Magic: Necromancy bonus: The users of this magic cast it on a daily basis, so there for we don't suffer from loss of concentration from useing Necromancy spells. Allow vampires access to Death and Shadow without paying 35 points.
Also IMO, we could use a lot more units. We have among the smallest Army selection in the game. Maybe warewolves would be fun. Oh, how about a lvl 4 caster hero who is a Lich. Maybe some Shadows that can be etherial scouting core.
Just my opinions.
Personally I would like to see more lords and hero's. Including a couple 650 point named charicters that can cause havok and go toe to toe with a DoC lord and not be sure who will win. Also two generic vamps in each Lord and Hero selection would be nice, that way we can correctly choose the best point values we have open. Also make our dragons more worth while. S2 breath weapon and 5+ Scaly is just sad for the points.
Core: Let Dire Wolves/Corpse Carts/Bat Swarms could to 25% of our basic core needed. Drop Skellie points to 5 and give a 5+ ward because most attacks on them shouldn't cause harm (i.e. a blow to the ribs wouldn't do crap, kind of like in D&D skellies take half damage vs blades). Zombies 2 points each, When ever a zombie does a wound, on a 5+ a new zombie joins the unit. Dire Wolves +1 attack and Str on charge. Ghouls, 6 or 7 points. Corpse Cart, make that ASF spell like the old bound spell, costs no dice but can be dispelled. Bat Swarms, drop price and make it so they don't suffer combat res.
Special: GG, drop down to 8-10 points each, add option to give full plate and option for flales. BK's, drop cost to 18 points, make barding 2 points, and option to make light cav with no barding. Fel Bats, consider T4, not sure. Spirit hosts, maybe make a bit cheaper.
Rare: Blood knights, base cost 45 points, option to give full plate. Drop Cairn Wraith price some.
Magic: Necromancy bonus: The users of this magic cast it on a daily basis, so there for we don't suffer from loss of concentration from useing Necromancy spells. Allow vampires access to Death and Shadow without paying 35 points.
Also IMO, we could use a lot more units. We have among the smallest Army selection in the game. Maybe warewolves would be fun. Oh, how about a lvl 4 caster hero who is a Lich. Maybe some Shadows that can be etherial scouting core.
Just my opinions.
TobinRoss89
Wight King
Aside from the normal ideas on how to fix skelies I would like to see a point cost reduction in blood knight and black knights or see the blood knights get t5 or a 1+ save or dare I say 2 wounds each. Other than that our book is fine game play wise, though I would be a very happy undead player if blood lines came back in a way.
Pietr Von Carstein
Varghulf
I don't think bloodknights should get either T5 or 2 wounds , that would make them almost as good as heroes in profile .
Pietr Von Carstein said:
....yes? and?
I kid.It'd be pretty broken though. It'd cost your whole army, but god it would be broken. That and a new Master power: Summon Knights. Jeesus! :devil2:
Jesus many of these suggestions are quite off the wall to say the least
Mad Larkin you must be quite mad indeed ; ), Skeletons at 3 points WITH shield and light armour per model with the option of flails? (Its not like the animator can pick out the skeletons according to which weapons they were wielding while they were alive.. What makes most sense by far is just a hand weapon and shield, as this can be anything, clubs axes, swords, and spears aswell which makes sense as its basically the cheapest weapon possible and were probably used abundantly in the ancient times i WHFB) And you wanna make ghouls better? They are bordering on overpowered atm imo, Somewhat balanced by the fact they cant take full command) Someone suggested zombies with WS 2 Toughness 3 for 3 points a model... Thats like skavenslaves only more broken as they dont run and with fear...
Vampire infantry? Vampires are already incredibly rare and its not like the existing vampire wanna bring alot of new ones into the world, as this drains there power / possibly creates rivals. The blood knights were a special special case because of the circumstances surrounding there founding.
Some people wanted stronger magic items.. We have pretty much alot of the best magic items in the game, what i wouldnt do just to have something comparable in some of my other lists..
Also ranged troops of any kind doesnt suit vc alot imo, It takes alot more concentration to actually make skeletons reload there weapon, aim and fire etc then to just scramble forward and stab and slash I would imagine.. And the same for warmachines. Im sure it could be done, but still.. I just dont feel it fits. The Undead is supposed to just be a huge horde of shambling corpses that horrifyingly just keeps coming and coming, in my mind.. I dont feel ranged troops fit with this. If anything then there should be the option to include living troops like suggested.
I mean guys, wishlisting is fine and everything, but please keep things at least some what realistic and at the very least fluffy. Thats the biggest reason I see why people want things changed as far as i can see.
Well onto my suggestions then,
Zombies, characters should be able to join them, and bump there toughness to 3.. Then maybe an option to make them 'infected/cursed' zombies or something (Remember the fluff is not like in the zombie movies where you turn into a zombie when bitten) making what they kill raise back, It would need quite a bit of balancing though and could possibly make the rules unnecessarily complicated, which seems to be what GW is shying away from in this edition.
"A skilled Necromancer can reanimate the corpses of the recently dead, causing them to walk again. Zombies may be slow and plodding, but they're tough deliberate opponents that can shrug off blows that would fell a living target. They feel no pain and will never retreat from battle.
Zombies lack any capacity for independent thought and are controlled solely by the Necromancer who summons them. Given their resiliency, it's far easier to kill the Necromancer controlling the animated corpses rather than to try and do battle with a legion of undead. " - Hammerwiki
Yeah they should definitely have higher toughness or some kind of save..
Master necromancer (Heinrich Kemmeler style) An individual with a very strong will and magic ability. He have to be army general, And you cant take any vampires in the list, as they wouldn't subject to a mere human. Units can match when he is within 6" and probably of other necromancers when he is the general. And there should be several advantages of course, different units / stronger wrights etc. Maybe giving this style of army the ability to take stronger zombies/skeletons with different equipment, as the necromancer spends more time perfecting his army and such. Probably not gonna happen, but would be cool.
In thread with this I find it pretty dumb that necromancers are undead aswell, and think this should be changed. Maybe same with ghouls
Like mentioned, Bloodlines is something they should bring back. The vampire book for the last edition was actually very nice imo, they should mix these two books and bring some of the old stuff back.
Skeletons need to be cheaper, not buffed in any other way. 7 points, or maybe without light amour for 6.. but that would be pushing it.
Direwolfs, either devastating charge or slavering charge back. I saw no reason to remove fast cav either. They shouldnt be frenzy thats for sure, that would make them next to useless.
The Vampire lore definitely needs to be rethought, I felt there were some al right suggestions in this thread, with the powerlevels etc.
Zombie giant would be extremely cool, maybe make it a choice if fielding a master necromancer? And make it actually useful unlike the current giants.. It should crumble for sure and have cloud of flies for sure, maybe a breathweapon.. Or or or make it a possible mount for the master necromancer, who would then be able to give it a huge ward/regenerate save.. There is a lot of ideas to be played around with here.
Mad Larkin you must be quite mad indeed ; ), Skeletons at 3 points WITH shield and light armour per model with the option of flails? (Its not like the animator can pick out the skeletons according to which weapons they were wielding while they were alive.. What makes most sense by far is just a hand weapon and shield, as this can be anything, clubs axes, swords, and spears aswell which makes sense as its basically the cheapest weapon possible and were probably used abundantly in the ancient times i WHFB) And you wanna make ghouls better? They are bordering on overpowered atm imo, Somewhat balanced by the fact they cant take full command) Someone suggested zombies with WS 2 Toughness 3 for 3 points a model... Thats like skavenslaves only more broken as they dont run and with fear...
Vampire infantry? Vampires are already incredibly rare and its not like the existing vampire wanna bring alot of new ones into the world, as this drains there power / possibly creates rivals. The blood knights were a special special case because of the circumstances surrounding there founding.
Some people wanted stronger magic items.. We have pretty much alot of the best magic items in the game, what i wouldnt do just to have something comparable in some of my other lists..
Also ranged troops of any kind doesnt suit vc alot imo, It takes alot more concentration to actually make skeletons reload there weapon, aim and fire etc then to just scramble forward and stab and slash I would imagine.. And the same for warmachines. Im sure it could be done, but still.. I just dont feel it fits. The Undead is supposed to just be a huge horde of shambling corpses that horrifyingly just keeps coming and coming, in my mind.. I dont feel ranged troops fit with this. If anything then there should be the option to include living troops like suggested.
I mean guys, wishlisting is fine and everything, but please keep things at least some what realistic and at the very least fluffy. Thats the biggest reason I see why people want things changed as far as i can see.
Well onto my suggestions then,
Zombies, characters should be able to join them, and bump there toughness to 3.. Then maybe an option to make them 'infected/cursed' zombies or something (Remember the fluff is not like in the zombie movies where you turn into a zombie when bitten) making what they kill raise back, It would need quite a bit of balancing though and could possibly make the rules unnecessarily complicated, which seems to be what GW is shying away from in this edition.
"A skilled Necromancer can reanimate the corpses of the recently dead, causing them to walk again. Zombies may be slow and plodding, but they're tough deliberate opponents that can shrug off blows that would fell a living target. They feel no pain and will never retreat from battle.
Zombies lack any capacity for independent thought and are controlled solely by the Necromancer who summons them. Given their resiliency, it's far easier to kill the Necromancer controlling the animated corpses rather than to try and do battle with a legion of undead. " - Hammerwiki
Yeah they should definitely have higher toughness or some kind of save..
Master necromancer (Heinrich Kemmeler style) An individual with a very strong will and magic ability. He have to be army general, And you cant take any vampires in the list, as they wouldn't subject to a mere human. Units can match when he is within 6" and probably of other necromancers when he is the general. And there should be several advantages of course, different units / stronger wrights etc. Maybe giving this style of army the ability to take stronger zombies/skeletons with different equipment, as the necromancer spends more time perfecting his army and such. Probably not gonna happen, but would be cool.
In thread with this I find it pretty dumb that necromancers are undead aswell, and think this should be changed. Maybe same with ghouls
Like mentioned, Bloodlines is something they should bring back. The vampire book for the last edition was actually very nice imo, they should mix these two books and bring some of the old stuff back.
Skeletons need to be cheaper, not buffed in any other way. 7 points, or maybe without light amour for 6.. but that would be pushing it.
Direwolfs, either devastating charge or slavering charge back. I saw no reason to remove fast cav either. They shouldnt be frenzy thats for sure, that would make them next to useless.
The Vampire lore definitely needs to be rethought, I felt there were some al right suggestions in this thread, with the powerlevels etc.
Zombie giant would be extremely cool, maybe make it a choice if fielding a master necromancer? And make it actually useful unlike the current giants.. It should crumble for sure and have cloud of flies for sure, maybe a breathweapon.. Or or or make it a possible mount for the master necromancer, who would then be able to give it a huge ward/regenerate save.. There is a lot of ideas to be played around with here.
skeletons: cost 6 points with hand weapon, light armour and shield
armor choice: +1 if you want heavy armour
weapons choice:
+1 if you want spear or crossbow
ghouls: same cost +
scavengers: (roll D6: 1 they don't enter, 2-3 left, 4-5 right, 6 you choose)
Special rule: "FEED US" they can't pursue because they stay and feed
blood knights: ok BUT initiative 5 (6 shall be too much...) or a 5+ ward save (they are 55 points vampires, c'mon)
Varghulf: give him the 3D6 charge (swiftstride) with a special rule.
He could have a "heavy furs" :tongue: 5+ armour save
vampires: Initiative and weapons skill 8 for lords ... Of course they can't have "Life" , "Heavens" and "Light" Lores
Zombies: T3 and special rule "HUNGRY" : every model killed by zombies became a zombie
Direwolves: 2 attacks each one or give them venom attack.
armor choice: +1 if you want heavy armour
weapons choice:
+1 if you want spear or crossbow
ghouls: same cost +
scavengers: (roll D6: 1 they don't enter, 2-3 left, 4-5 right, 6 you choose)
Special rule: "FEED US" they can't pursue because they stay and feed
blood knights: ok BUT initiative 5 (6 shall be too much...) or a 5+ ward save (they are 55 points vampires, c'mon)
Varghulf: give him the 3D6 charge (swiftstride) with a special rule.
He could have a "heavy furs" :tongue: 5+ armour save
vampires: Initiative and weapons skill 8 for lords ... Of course they can't have "Life" , "Heavens" and "Light" Lores
Zombies: T3 and special rule "HUNGRY" : every model killed by zombies became a zombie
Direwolves: 2 attacks each one or give them venom attack.
I'd bring back the Bloodlines, but I'd also have "generic" vampire powers that any of them could use. I miss them.
I'd bring back the multiple level Invocation like we had in 6th. Perhaps removing the multiple casting. With, still limited, effectiveness on some units. Though Skeletons, Grave Guard, and Zombies (with a bonus as usual) being easily effected. I'd retain it as a spell that Vampires automatically know, so any Vampire caster would know it... or make it the base spell so all *could* have it.
Skeletons and Zombies, both, could be raised beyond starting number by default. GG couldn't most likely (short of an item possibly (not a power)).
Ghouls as skirmishers again. I liked that, either that or ranked up with the sneaky advance or whatever it is called. Maybe make them alive again.
I kinda like Necros as they are, so they'd be *very* similar.
Cheaper Bloodknights, but they'd lose Frenzy.
Zombies would stay S2, but I'd make them T3 to make them less squishy... without being great at combat either. Maybe some level of light armor perhaps. I like that zombies don't kill much, but I wish they didn't die in droves... either that or keep them very squishy... but make crumble far less brutal on them. Perhaps if they have more ranks, they don't crumble.
I'd make GG a point cheaper. They're good now, but I think with the deadlier combats and are crumble, they could do down a point in cost.
I'm still wondering how Spirit Host do in 8th... but I'd like to make them more worthwhile. They don't have to be great, I just want them to be worth around their points.
I'd like to make Dire Wolves a bit better again, perhaps bringing back the Slavering charge.
Edit: Oh... and a SC to make GG core... or at least one unit of them to be core!
I'd bring back the multiple level Invocation like we had in 6th. Perhaps removing the multiple casting. With, still limited, effectiveness on some units. Though Skeletons, Grave Guard, and Zombies (with a bonus as usual) being easily effected. I'd retain it as a spell that Vampires automatically know, so any Vampire caster would know it... or make it the base spell so all *could* have it.
Skeletons and Zombies, both, could be raised beyond starting number by default. GG couldn't most likely (short of an item possibly (not a power)).
Ghouls as skirmishers again. I liked that, either that or ranked up with the sneaky advance or whatever it is called. Maybe make them alive again.
I kinda like Necros as they are, so they'd be *very* similar.
Cheaper Bloodknights, but they'd lose Frenzy.
Zombies would stay S2, but I'd make them T3 to make them less squishy... without being great at combat either. Maybe some level of light armor perhaps. I like that zombies don't kill much, but I wish they didn't die in droves... either that or keep them very squishy... but make crumble far less brutal on them. Perhaps if they have more ranks, they don't crumble.
I'd make GG a point cheaper. They're good now, but I think with the deadlier combats and are crumble, they could do down a point in cost.
I'm still wondering how Spirit Host do in 8th... but I'd like to make them more worthwhile. They don't have to be great, I just want them to be worth around their points.
I'd like to make Dire Wolves a bit better again, perhaps bringing back the Slavering charge.
Edit: Oh... and a SC to make GG core... or at least one unit of them to be core!
the ability to take grave guard as core would be awesome. Don't know if it'll be balanced though. But that would be a sweet blood dragons power (or unlocked by a blood dragons special character)
BLOODLINES!!!!!
Abhorash as a character - better than archaon (he's the perfect warrior!)
Zacharias back.
Neferata
A strigoi character
(i dont ever use special characters, but they would be cool!)
Bows for skellies
Wight King Lords (like Tomb Kings). I love vamps, but i quite like the idea of an army being raised purely by random dark magic.
Blood Knights on Foot. Same stats, but on foot, with GW options. Not sure on points. I's day about 23? Less save and movement makes them about chosen standard (which they should be).
Special steadfast rule: If they have more ranks than the enemy, they count as losing by 1, or one less (to be used in conjuction with BSB).
Extra wound for the Varghulf.
Cheaper Zombies.
And stat buffs from the necromancy lore.
Abhorash as a character - better than archaon (he's the perfect warrior!)
Zacharias back.
Neferata
A strigoi character
(i dont ever use special characters, but they would be cool!)
Bows for skellies
Wight King Lords (like Tomb Kings). I love vamps, but i quite like the idea of an army being raised purely by random dark magic.
Blood Knights on Foot. Same stats, but on foot, with GW options. Not sure on points. I's day about 23? Less save and movement makes them about chosen standard (which they should be).
Special steadfast rule: If they have more ranks than the enemy, they count as losing by 1, or one less (to be used in conjuction with BSB).
Extra wound for the Varghulf.
Cheaper Zombies.
And stat buffs from the necromancy lore.
I am actually fine with it as is. Just make the zombies more useful and I would consider it perfect.