VC with Mantic models.

[Jacques Dauger De Cavoye]

Hi all! This will be my first post on carpe noctum, so wanted to say hi and ask a few questions. for starters, does anybody have experience using the mantic undead with their VC army? I sincerely dislike a lot of the GW models, as well as the fact that they cost so much, so when I stumbled across the mantic undead I finally found the inspiration to play VC. The main inquiry I have is about the skeletons and revenants from mantic. I was planning on using the skeleton models as GG and converting their spears to scythes and using them as great weapons, while the revenants as skeletons with hand weapons and shields. Has anybody ever done this before? Have people seen this happen? Anyone think it will work? That's all I really wanted to know for now, so if anybody could throw a comment in that would be great.

Thanks, Cavoye

 

[akiro27]

Mantic has some great stuff. I actually prefer the mantic ghouls to GWs. Picked up quite a few of them to fill my ranks. I am just about to buy a few sets of revenant cavalry to use as Black Knights. GWs are too expensive to field a good number of them. GW definitely has a problem with their cost-to-points ratio.

An example: I was "relatively" ok paying more for Blood Knights, being that they are an iconic power-unit (still too expensive), but for Black Knights? Getting a decent unit of them is like buying the battalion box all over again. Same problem with Zombies, Skeletons and Ghouls. </rant>

I've seen Mantic showing up more and more in armies, but haven't seen a GG conversion yet. I say go for it! Should work just fine

-aki

 

[Skittles]

I too have been building primarily with Mantic. I will warn you, 6 of 10 skelleton/revenant bodies per sprue have a shield molded onto them. However, if you don't mind your army having a 60/40 split of skeletons/grave guard, you could probably mix and match the models, since you are having vastly different weapon options for each set.


Come to think of it, why didn't I think of this before I built everything...

 

[Jacques Dauger De Cavoye]

I too have been building primarily with Mantic. I will warn you, 6 of 10 skelleton/revenant bodies per sprue have a shield molded onto them. However, if you don't mind your army having a 60/40 split of skeletons/grave guard, you could probably mix and match the models, since you are having vastly different weapon options for each set.


Come to think of it, why didn't I think of this before I built everything...

Well skittles, you make a valid point. I have thought of this, and decided I may as well just make do with what they give me (This army obviously won't be doing tournaments ) and do heavy converting with the rest. I was wondering skittles, do you use mantic skeletons/revenants in your army? do you just field them as they come? Also, if you guys care enough I guess I could post some pictures of converted models when done. If nobody else is doing it, I may as well pioneer the field.

Cavoye

 

[Skittles]

Yes. I have two units of 40 skells, 40 revenants, and 60 ghouls that I rotate in and out of my list. At some point I'll probably get around to building the zombies I have. I built everything w/ HW/SH.

I'm definitely a fan. I picked up 2 large army boxes ( almost 200 mini's ) for a little more than the cost of a GW battalion box.

I'm currently in the process of preparing most of my models for the minwax bath, but if all goes well I'll try to post some pics in the next few weeks.

 

[Fenriswulf]

Mantic have proven to be the best value for money miniatures for me, hands down. I bought two of the large army box sets, and now have some ridiculous amount of guys to use (40 ghouls, 40 revenants, 80 skeletons and 60 zombies), all of whom are more aesthetically pleasing as the undead from GW, whose sculpts suffer from huge hands and heads, and stumpy leg and short torso syndrome.

The only problem I have encountered is that Mantic ghouls only have 2 different bodies to a sprue. An easy solution is to interchange the legs from the ones in the Zombie sprue for more variety. That, and using some Zombie heads and modifying your guys as needed. Other than that, they're excellent.

As an Australian, I am being severely ripped off by GW due to its international pricing structure. I purchased both Mantic box sets for $135AUD. That's about 60 cents a miniature. There is no way in hell I could get anywhere near what GW is offering for that price. I have recently bought another 40 ghouls, and one box set of 10 resin/plastic wraiths from Mantic is what it will cost for just one of the new Cairn Wraiths if I am not mistaken.

In the end, I chose Mantic because the miniatures look great, the price is brilliant, and they actually give a damn about their customers. I intend to buy more armies from them in the future, and look forward to their rules systems too.

 

[scarletsquig]

I bought two of the large army box sets, and now have some ridiculous amount of guys to use

Ditto. Massively pleased with the purchase and have nothing but good things to say about Mantic.

Highly recommended.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

I did a review here that might help:

https://www.vampirecounts.net/Thread-Review-of-Mantic-s-Skeletons-and-Ghouls-by-Disciple-of-Nagash

 

[ConfuciusSaidTooMuch]

This is so true.

In South Africa though we struggle to get anything other than GW at astronomically increased prices - or on sale or special at your local club ( if you are lucky ).

Luckily someone who had bought mantic previously was looking to off load I too have bought cavalry to change into black knights, kings of cabal to make a banshee, bsb, necro and to make wight king. Add to that revenant to change into GG.

Stuck on some fresh conversion ideas though.

Help please.

ConfuciusSaaidTooMuch

 

[tinfish]

I picked these guys up aswell, £43 for 110 undead models.
40 Skellies, 20 Grave Guard (revenants) 30 Zombies and 20 Ghouls.

Mantic also do 60 Zombies for £35 and 50 Ghouls for £30.

Frankly if they were utterly awefull, it would be a good deal, as it is I find them superiour to the somewhat goofy and square headed GW infantry.

I was surprised by the detail in the models, the Grave Guard (revenants) especially.

That and it cost me £30 for 50 ghouls, £20 for 10 at GW.

They rank up with ease, are detailed enough to take a worthwile paintjob, are light, look more like fear inspiring undead rather than Gw's worryingly slack jawed jockel undead.

I personnally dislike the Mantic cavalry, although they are more accuratly scaled then the GW equivilants, why are undead horses larger than living ones? Guess bones grow in death

I would reccomend Mantics undead to anyone, not just due to the massive financial saving, but because they are downright superiour.

That said... take a very close look at any metal kits, they aren't so impressive.

I forgot the point of the thread, sorry lol.

The skeletons come with a spear or sword option, the Revenants have swords.
Both kits have a mix of guys with and without shields molded onto the model.
The swords and spears for both are seperate and must be glued to the hands, this makes throwing a replacing their weapons very simple, just glue a great weapon into their hands.

I mainly use Ghouls and Zombies, so haven't experimented with Skellies, mine use sword & board as standard, not like I expect them to kill much, so I want them to actually live a turn.
Still a total VC noob, mine are not even worth fielding yet, hope you have fun with them! I know I will

 

[Krysdagger]

I just want to add that I took the Mantic skeletons and swapped in GW Skeleton heads (you should have a lot of extra's kicking around if you have ever bought 1 or 2 boxes) and spears and swords. The scale of the weapons for GW is quite a bit larger.

I think the mantic models look better on the table with the rest of the GW stuff with that simple swap (I should get off my lazy ass and take pictures). I also found the Mantic skeleton faces a little comical for my taste, the GW ones look more realistic (you know.. for walking skeletons with spears )

Krys.

 

[Sception]

Mantic models are cheaper, certainly. Their overall proportions are right for warhammer games, and the range of available models translates well.

The quality is an issue - GW models have finer detail, generally more posability and variety, and on some models better proportions. In sculpt quality I'd say mantic's about ten years behind games workshop. That said, I loved GW models 10 years ago, so it's certainly a playable quality. But if you put a mantic skeleton or revenant or revenant knight next to a GW skeleton or grave guard or black knight; or if you put a mantic necromancer or revenant hero next to the current GW plastic necromancer or wight king, there's absolutely no question which model is higher quality.

Of course, some of the current GW models (zombies, mounted wight king, etc) are like 15 years old, and if you put them next to mantic stuff the mantic stuff looks better. Plus there are some GW models that have notably better detail and skulpting, but have made stylastic choices that people don't like, and that might cause them to prefer mantic equivalents (ghouls especially come to mind here, but potentially also blood knights with their giant batwing helmets, or the current line of vampire models that many feel are too chaosy).

And also, some just like the retro feel of some of the mantic models. GW skeletons are better proportioned and have finer detail and look more cool and menacing overall, but mantic skeletons have a lot more personality to them - it may be a sort of goofy personality, but that might be preferred by people who want an Army of Darkness sort of vibe.


And then there's the price again. Even if you prefer some of the GW models, they may simply be out of your price range, and short of elaborate conversions from cheaper models (including the modeling skills to pull them off), mantic may offer the only alternative you can viably resort to to field certain units. Where exactly this threshold is varies from player to player, of course. For me, it's Blood Knights. I simply cannot afford $20us per model for a cavalry regiment. If I wanted to field them, I'd either have to convert from cheaper models (chaos knights or dragon princes being the most likely contenders) or I'd have to look at alternative models options, and Mantic seems to offer the best bang for the buck, here. That said, I frankly do have an acceptable level of modeling skill and really dislike mantic cav models, so I'd probably go for conversions. Thankfully my Mortis Engine, Terrorgheist, and Varghulf don't generally leave me looking for other rare options, and if I'm going cavstar I'll stick to the fantastic black knight models. Speaking of,

Black Knights, at $6 per cavalry model, are within my budget, if only barely, and I would gladly pay the extra couple bucks a model compared to Mantic for what I see as an incredible jump in quality. Seriously, the current black knight models are absolutely fantastic. Still, if my financial situation were only a little bit more restricted than it is, I wouldn't be able to justify buying them, no matter how much I liked the models.

Grave guard at $4us a model? When you want 30 to 40 of them in a unit? That's hard to justify. Same for skittles at $3us a model when you want upwards of 50 per unit. Zombies are a better deal than skeletons, but as mentioned Mantic models actually look better (though in a reversal of the skeleton situation, GW zombies have more variety / personality) and are still cheaper, so that's not even a question. Ghouls have already been discussed.


So, in general? I find Mantic to be the better option for infantry, either because the GW models are cost prohibitive (grave guard, skeletons), or just don't look as nice (zombies for model quality, ghouls for styalistic reasons). But for characters, cav, and fancy stuff (corpse cart, for instance), I'd much rather stick to GW for model quality reasons, with possibly a few options drawn from other alternatives (there are some nice vampire models out there, for instance).


Of courss ALL of the above is dependent on you having a gaming environment where non-GW models are allowed in the first place. If you mostly play in GW stores, that's that, no reason to bother getting worked up about it.

 

[tinfish]

Avatars of war is worth a look for Vampire Characters, they aren't GW quality, but they are far better than Mantic quality.
They actually have good infantry models for a few armies, their WoC troops are great for example.

I personally cannot bring myself to part with £93 for 60 models that I can buy for £30. But.. I do prefer the Mantic ghouls, skellies, zombies and i find the Revenants acceptable as Grave Guard subs, given that you get 60 of them for £30 quid.

Thing is I have 20 already, I might skip another Skelly regiment, get the 60 grave guard and mix in 40 of them with Skellies, that will leave me with 80 skellies and 40 GG. 80 ghouls and 90 zombies.. all for a fraction of the cost.

To be fair I own 8 WFB armies and 4 40K Armies, and out of all my other games combined I have one none GW character, for me it is not just about the price, but considering the phenominal savings, it is certainly worth a look.

You know your going to need 20+ more zombies than you start the game with, same with skellies, then look at what GW charge for essential core troops and they only have themselves to blame.

With bloodkights also being insanely priced, I would probably have skipped VC all-togther, imagine what they would cost to bring up from scratch these days?

I started out with a Mantic army from Wayland games, 110 models.
40 skelletons
20 Revenants (GG)
20 Ghouls
30 Zeds
Cost £43.

GW cost. £174.75 (iirc) More actually, as you cannot buy a box of ten zeds.

Damn.. I never actually worked that out before. And for close to £200 quid, you have nothing.. that army I listed is unusable, I still have to add characters and something that can dish out a bit of punishment.
Just glad I bought 5 of my armies pre 8th.

 

[Feast4Crows]

My army is largely Mantic. I still use GW ghouls and GG, simply because I prefer those models. My oy concern with Mantic are their revenant cavalry. I bought two boxes because it was basically 20 knights for the price if 10 GW black knights. The difference in scale is definitely noticeable with the cavalry. My characters are mainly GW and they're huge in comparison, especially the newer horses. Personally, I prefer the more realistic scale of Mantic's minis, so I'm actually looking for some alternatives for the mounted characters. However, in separate units, the difference in scale is tolerable.

 

[hairyjeff]

I've posted a lot about Mantic before now, so to recap-
infantry good, most characters very iffy, cavalry ok, but don't mix with GW at all well.
However, in terms of cost, there's no contest. I'm lucky, I have a huge, old model collection, but still, if a top up is needed, it,s usually mantic. Vary zombies with other parts ( mantic elf sprues include elf skulls, and broken/shattered equipment) from GW or mantic boxes; same for ghouls. Some skellies will take easy adaptation, but not all. Good luck !