Black Coach

[Aren]

Hey all, I am thinking of getting a Black Coach as it fits my army theme quite nicely and would offer a very tough unit for my army, something which is quite lacking at the moment. So I generally want to know : how does it play? Is it a viable unit worth the £36 GW is asking for or would that money be spent better somewhere else? The model itself doesn't have me crazy for it, it's quite old and I would have to at least replace the horses if not more.

I was thinking of using it to charge enemy units and keep them in place while a more killy unit flanks them and delivers the killing blow.

Thoughts, ideas?

 

[Minty]

I really feel as though you've answered your own question.

Actually, as a general thing, if you're asking someone to talk you into doing something, it's because deep down you don't really want to do that thing...


In this specific case, you're not wild about the model and you don't really know what you'd do with it (crash it into the bad guys to hold them up is what fully 50% of our army is for. It's not a specific job for any unit), so no. No it doesn't seem like a good addition to your army.

Like you said, 36 is a lot of pounds for one model you don't like.

 

[Adam_Barrow]

Do you take a lot of magic phase shenanigans (Balefire Cart, Staff of Sorcery, Black Periapt)? The Coach and a Tome Engine both fit at 2.5k pts and they both play with magic phase stuff.

 

[Aren]

Yep, I play the magic vampire lord, even though now he is much worse than last edition. I take a few magic artefacts and generally rely on magic to boost my army. Thing is I LOVE the idea of the black coach, I really like the way it becomes more powerful and it fits perfectly with the "Dracula" theme. If only the model was better as my LGS owner really doesn't like non-GW units in GW games. It's not even a Games Workshop store.

I usually play 1500-2000 points as my army isn't massive.

Do I want the unit - yes. Do I like the model - no. Do I want to be stuck with a unit that will consistently die and not do much in games - no. That's why I'm getting feedback @Minty. Maybe I want talking out of getting it than talking me into it

 

[Minty]

my LGS owner really doesn't like non-GW units in GW games. It's not even a Games Workshop store.

That's... A new one.


Anyhoo. Talking you out of it seems simple enough, it's an ugly model that costs £36 and is made of Finecast. Pick any one of those three reasons or all of them.

Perhaps I'm bitter since I feel the same way you do. I love the idea but am left cold by, well, those three things I just said, and the fact that I have no clue what it's supposed to bring to the table. It's a poor solution to a problem the army doesn't have.

It's slow (until you charge it up), not very killy and relies on gimmicks to... Do whatever it is it's supposed to do.


I suspect it won't consistently die in most games, but I doubt it'll do anything either. Certainly nothing that the rest of your army isn't already doing.

 

[HeroZero]

First off your LGS owner sucks. He doesn't want alternative minis because of his own bottom line. Screw that.

The coach itself isn't bad, just random. But like many people will tell you it Doesn't have a role.
It's a narrow frontage model, so it does have the advantage of that aspect.

Once its got a few charges though it becomes a fairly solid killer.

 

[Lynks]

The black coach has a fantastic place in monster mash armies for limiting the ammount of attacks to your more squishy units (you charge the black coach in first and maximise in such a way that your lter charges will be fighting corner to corner or only a few models in base contact due to the 1 wheel when charging meaning they can't get more).

I've seen some people swapping out the horses for hexwraiths or in one case, the spectral horde from the coven throne, but that's hardly a cost effective solution so if the price is bugging you, you'd probably best avoid it (a sad thing for me to say because of my love for the black coach ).

 

[w'sorchai]

I have had a black coach for about 10 years. It is still bare metal un-assembled. I doubt i will run it with the current rules, it is hard to kill, but it is also slow.

By the sound of it, kitbash yourself a black coach out of other gw figs, that way you get a fig you will love and will be yours alone, and the lgs cant say boo as it is a conversion of gw figs.

 

[billybaker101]

As the black coach has the vampiric rule cant it march?

 

[w'sorchai]

It is also a chariot so it cant march .

 

[akiro27]

I like the coach - ever since i started playing O&G I have learned to appreciate the value of the chariot. Yes, it's expensive & in rare - however it's t6, 4 wounds (5 would have beennice), str 5 with a 3+ armor and 4++ ward with terror. That's GOOD. Even before powered up, that's GOOD. just shy of 200 points - that's a tough sell. In rare - that's a hard sell too! If this thing were special I think you'd see it a lot more. We have our TG which is just so fun that the coach gets overshadowed. But this thing plays WONDERFULLY with cavalry builds.

With all the elf-popularity we have right now, this thing will destroy them. Impact hits and high toughness (with an armor save/ward save) - better if it powers up, for sure - because then you almost dont have to worry about it in combat. Obviously, you can't throw it into ranked up CR-generating blocks until you're combo charging, but never underestimate attacks that happen before ASF (impact hits).

It's also going to be a lightning rod if your player knows what it will do and how unkillable it will become. People freak out at ethereal so it's going to take some heat off of the other items in your army - and with a 4+ ward, it's not going to die as fast (or become useless) like the TG.

Give it a try! Chariots are great - this one is one of the top chariots in warhammer IMO. Very odd unit and expensive but especially for what it buys OUR army, it's great.

-luke

 

[Demian]

I support akiro's opinion.

Elves will hate this with the new and popular "Shoot everything with arrow's" army, with just 1 ranked unit for support. The only problem it has while in combat is static CR, but it works wonders against any Cavalry, even Bretonnia's'!

Now, speaking of what would make a better investment, if you are looking to complete a competitive army, go for what you don't have that is priority: 2nd Mortis Engine, 2nd Terrorgheist, 2nd box of Black Knights, maybe even a 3rd, or convert them to your 2nd hexwraith unit, etc.

This model isn't very popular, and requires a lot of experimenting before you can max it's potential and your mony is well... invested? hehe.

Better complete your VC essentials and then go for the collection =)

 

[Aren]

Yeah, it's a pain. You see he doesn't stock any Mantic and I use Mantic zombies, ghouls and sometimes skellies. It's not that he doesn't let people use other company models but he is very clear that he doesn't like it and probably if all my other VC units weren't bought at his store (with a considerable loss as I could have bought them on Dark Sphere for cheaper) then I wouldn't be able to play. Annoying to say the least.

That might be an idea. I have been generally thinking of expanding my army. See, I have the opposite problem with Crypt Horrors - awesome models, good strong unit that would fit well with my other units BUT it doesn't follow my theme (aristocratic, honourable, "Dracula" undead) and their fluff goes against everything my army is.

I have:
Bunch of ghouls
Multitude of skellies
Load of zombies

Gaggle of Grave Guard (20 with GW)
Murder of Hexwraiths (5)
Swathe of Various Characters

A Tbat
Corpse cart
Varghulf


So yeah, it's not much of an army really, you can see why I want to expand. Since I play a lot of HE I am looking for a unit which can stand the torrent of ASF attacks and still live to do some damage. Also, they tend to have a lot of magical attacks so ethereals aren't really the way to go. Ideas?

Oh and should I start a different thread if we are going beyond the Black Coach or is it not a big enough topic?