Boycott of GW Products (Previously I've had it...)

[ironlord]

see i dont really use any of those things so that doesnt really affect me personally but i see your point...

i think we need to get a definative view on this, the more we look into this the more the boycott seems to be worse and worse as we realise that the damage we could do would kill the hobby we love and could achieve very little, im starting to have second thoughts on the boycott personally but ive been sitting on the fence for this whole thing anyway

 

[Bug16]

... we could do would kill the hobby we love

Rubbish, even if GW went under (which I seriously doubt they will), that doesn't stop you from playing WHFB or buying figures.

 

[Order of the Blood Dragon]

GW need to make a profit, and with new stuff being the easiest source of revenue they are raising the prices on those as people WILL buy them. However, what I dislike:
They insist that they have the best miniatures at great prices and the prices being good is slightly off.
They clearly said (in a WD, can't remember which one) that they needed to increase prices of metals, paints, boooks etc. BUT they said the plastics would remain the same value, look at the prices of the plastics made when they said this and look at the price of the greatswords.
I don't exactly have full (or much) info about how GW is doing in the economic crisis, but surely they should see reason, they contradict themselves repeatedly by saying the have the best value miniatures when their only advantage for plastics is in terms of customizing.
But what do I know, Viktor's just a Vampire, not a Lord... yet :konrad:

 

[Marcus Von Drac]

Errrrrm, not to kill the mood or anything, but have any of you actually asked at your local GW about the Greatswords now?
I went in yesterday, and have found out that the staff themselves have complained to the high-ups about their price. They didn't want to be bitched at and lets face it; they would have been as they are the face of GW. As a result of this, GW are putting the price where it should be: at £15.
Now I know that this boycott is more about the ethics and what course GW will take in the future, but still, as this is what started the whole argument off, I thought I should mention it.

 

[Order of the Blood Dragon]

We will fight them on the beaches and in the streets, we will never surrender.
You know why, because we're all Blood Dragons at heart so we don't surrender (or refuse challenges).

If they do change the prices to that value then I will be glad, I never wanted GreatSwords but it's good to know the store owners will do what I said above for us.
This does change the perspective quite alot, but I still dislike how similar the price of the plastic stank is in comparison with the original, so yes it's more customizable but the customisation would only be for asthetic reasons.

 

[Baslakor]

Four of my friends and me will join this holy crusade!

It is good that GW has changed this price and it is good that the store-staff agrees with this rightious cause. Yet we must not stop this battle and go on with our simple lives. This is not about the price of a few Empire soldiers, this is about doing what must be done. This is about showing what must be shown! With this action we can show the world that we can stand united and that we WILL fight back when needed to. Let them have two horrible months, let them see that there are borders that must NOT be crossed.

 

[The Dark Sheep]

...but I still dislike how similar the price of the plastic stank is in comparison with the original, so yes it's more customizable but the customisation would only be for asthetic reasons.

Believe me that one is actually worth it. I got to pick it up and look at the inside of it yesterday at my local store and I think I'm in love...

Nice to hear that they are lowering the price (Even though there's no sign of it on their website yet). If this is actually true I'll consider boycotting my own boycott :tongue:.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

That is excellent news! Plus it is great to see what I have been saying does stand true........if someone (in this case the store staff) does something instead of just sitting back and accepting things, it can make a difference.

 

[dictator]

I'm a logistician in learning and in my profession. I love it. What GW fails to realize is that by increasing the price they lower the base of who buys their products. If they were to save a dollar on the backend before we saw the product it would actually be two dollars profit plus a few in their pockets. Not only that but it draws more people in as it makes it more affordable to more individuals. What alarms me, is instead of looking inward to increase profit they look to add another straw on the back of the camel.

Like frito-lays here in the states has added 20% more product for free into all their items at no cost to the customer, why can't GW do the same? Either way if they would figure out that distribution, creation, or a combination of other variables can make them more money by being smarter at their end of the product. The potential is there they just don't see it through the fog of idiocy.

I think I have droned on to much and find myself painted into a corner again with my words. Looking at other ideas I mainly see failure. I haven't bought GW products directly for about ten years now minus my White Dwarf subscription. They won't change with a boycott. Little kids will continue to whine until their parents buy the models. I do agree writing letters but they will fall on deaf ears I fear.

What GW needs is an innovator to see into the future and give them new direction. We will buy their product proportional to our wants and how deep our wallets go. If they have more product that will undercut every adversary out there I'll buy without feeling like I just got raped. What really needs to happen is that all the original makers of GW should be benched and put into a deep, deep, deep cave. After this is done, bring in a Lee Iakoka(sp?), just like McDonald's and we will be able to breathe a sigh of relief. Until then we must trudge through the swamp infested with greedy mosquitos looking for one more dollar/pound/yen/euro to suck from your money bag.

My question is whether or not we will withstand this steaming pile of poop that we say is a boycott? I suggest we wait out the flaming bags GW leaves for us on our doorstep and hope they finally pull their heads out of their nether regions to see us completely pissed the f*#$ off!

 

[Bug16]

The potential is there they just don't see it through the fog of idiocy.

I suspect it's more arrogance, from years of believing their own hype, than mere idiocy that drives decisions at GW HQ.

They won't change with a boycott.

Silent boycotts have worked in the past with GW. When they released the first multipart plastic terminators (the ones in Space Hulk V2, I think around 1995?) they attempted to charge £25 for 5 of them. Nobody bought them, so they very quietly dropped the price down to a still painful £20 but people started to buy them.

What GW needs is an innovator to see into the future and give them new direction.

GW genuinely seem scared of innovation. Innovation is risk and risk costs money. Instead they just stick to the same tired forumla and wonder why they make less money each year. They can only flog the same horse for so long.

We will buy their product proportional to our wants and how deep our wallets go. If they have more product that will undercut every adversary out there I'll buy without feeling like I just got raped.

Absolutely. They still fail to understand that if they lower prices people will buy more of their product rather than either abandoning their product completely or leaving the wargaming hobby full stop.

What really needs to happen is that all the original makers of GW should be benched and put into a deep, deep, deep cave.

ROTFL!

 

[One-FISH-]

I've got wayyyy too many models to build- so buying anymore at this point would be fruitless. I am completely in. I'll tell my friends to consider it as well. I think if you're going to boycott, boycott personally as long as is comfortable to you.

Trust me, they'll feel every penny in this economy.

 

[Rael]

After much thinking about this topic and reading your comments I feel the best thing we can do,that might actually get a responce, is boycot the actual high priced item.

 

[Order of the Blood Dragon]

A thousand nations of the GW empire will descend upon GW HQ.

 

[S'tan]

I'm a logistician in learning and in my profession. I love it. What GW fails to realize is that by increasing the price they lower the base of who buys their products. If they were to save a dollar on the backend before we saw the product it would actually be two dollars profit plus a few in their pockets. Not only that but it draws more people in as it makes it more affordable to more individuals. What alarms me, is instead of looking inward to increase profit they look to add another straw on the back of the camel.

This reminds me of one of the legendary 'Tom and Jerry' cartoons, the one where they travel to..NY?...and some other mice explain mass production and mass consumption and that was the moment I started getting some ideas on how it works. I was previously unable to comprehend why lowering the price of an item would actually make your more profit. (gimme a break, I was like 6 ) Maybe someone should play that to GW staff, especially that Tom Kirby bloke who I blame for more that half of the shit that's happening at GW's.






PS: That Tom & Jerry had a really epic ending. When the old mouse asked if they now understand mass consumption and mass production, another (female) old mouse replied: ''Understand, I'm a victim of it!'' followed by general laughter. Good times, good times

 

[Ergo-Sum]

I think, with my own professional hat on, that it's a falacity to think that GW would make more money if they lowered their prices, I think they'd make actually make less revenue than they do now.

The nature of their product, combined with the type of market they sell to, which we know is typically only buying their product for 3-5 years, means that there is little incentive for them to lower price. They are effectively, selling us consumer durables with no expirey date and who will never be made out of date. Once you've brought those 20 Zombies off them, you'll never need to buy the same 20 Zombies, hence higher prices work in their favour as you're only going to by each individual figure once. There is a certain argument about detering new customers with prices, but that has been somewhat countered by their (I'm sure must be) loss leader starter sets.

I know, like everyone else, how annoying prices rises are, but the majority of us her are not their primary market any way. As most posters have said, how much actual stuff have you brought in the last few months? How much unpainted/part painted stuff have you lying around anyway?

 

[Onikaigo]

Once you've brought those 20 Zombies off them, you'll never need to buy the same 20 Zombies,

Rubbish, I say! You always need to own more zombies!

But, you bring up a solid point on the longevity of the product they sell, which is essentially shooting themselves down. If you already have 20 Goldswords, why would you need to buy more? So your potential yield in that field is nullified. Same witha Stank. Who needs more than one? Two is evil enough, and three or more is insanity. Really. Don't do it.

How much unpainted/part painted stuff have you lying around anyway?

You're spying on me. I've got far too much, and I find that disturbing. .....need paints. ;;>>

 

[Ergo-Sum]

Ha, your right! You do need more Zombies, but not the 'same' 20, you've brought those already.

Yeah, I've met anyone in this hobby without unpainted minitures .... waits five minutes now for all the people to come on this thread and tell me how they paint every miniture they own after a day of owning it!

 

[One-FISH-]

I know, like everyone else, how annoying prices rises are, but the majority of us her are not their primary market any way. As most posters have said, how much actual stuff have you brought in the last few months? How much unpainted/part painted stuff have you lying around anyway?

A) But how many of us buy things even though we have other models to build/paint? (I have an entire half of my VC army yet to build!!!)

B) Just wanted to let you all know that I told my friends who have in turn taken up arms on several of the other Forums. Uthuan, druchii.net and whatnot. It seems we do have some sort of small movement going.

 

[Ergo-Sum]

I would guess though, that the majority of GW sales come from the 12-18 age range, and that's probably pushing it at the top end. We are not the people that really make much of a difference to their sales. Of course we all buy stuff even though we have unpainted models, but not to the level that stopping buying it will have an impact on their revenue.

 

[One-FISH-]

Well if we all do it...and we all stop doing it....Idk, at least its voting with your dollar.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

I know where Ergo is coming from, but I will still do what I can. It may not be much, but at least I know I tried.

 

[Ergo-Sum]

I think agree though, almost any action is better than inaction. I'd rather be Don Quixote, tilting at windmills, than Chamerlain.

 

[Disciple of Nagash]

As the price has now been brought down....

Unstickied

 

[The Dark Sheep]

They have? It seems to me that it's still £25...

 

[N1AK]

I'm a logistician in learning and in my profession. I love it.

As a Logistician, I am sure you can see the logic in leaving economics to Economists and Management to Managers? Frankly product can be one of the least logical bits of human psyche thanks to things like inverse price correlation.

If they were to save a dollar on the backend before we saw the product it would actually be two dollars profit plus a few in their pockets.

You mean like the £30 million cost cutting and efficiency drive they just spent the last two years implementing? Or do you mean like the 'satellite stores' they are opening in the UK (aiming for 50 by 2012) that only have one staff member and only open 5 days a week thus lowering staffing costs?

Any fool knows that saving money is better than increasing revenue. The question is whether the measures that GW is taking to decrease costs are correct, whether they are missing better ones and whether price rises are having a negative effect.

Frankly I don't think either of us know nearly enough about the company to debate this categorically, and I say this even though I (frankly, but truthfully) have a much better understanding of GWs recent actions and plans than you.

---

I would guess though, that the majority of GW sales come from the 12-18 age range, and that's probably pushing it at the top end. We are not the people that really make much of a difference to their sales. Of course we all buy stuff even though we have unpainted models, but not to the level that stopping buying it will have an impact on their revenue.

I have never been certain on who GWs 'main' market is. I know someone who spent £3,000 on the apocalypse release day and now has 12 Super heavies. This person is around 40, and I expect it would take a sizeable number of teens to match his spending.

Personally I spend around £800 per year on Games Workshop products, I really don't know how this compares with other people but I thought I'd throw it out there so people can compare.

I think one thing that is true is that even if the youngsters (12-15) don't spend as much as adults, they are the potential future adult gamers. I started Warhammer 13 years ago when I was 12! I didn't spend much at the time but they'll have got a few thousand £s out of me by now. Even if only 5% of teens stick the hobby out to old age that's big money.