Vampire Counts Rumours

[MarkM]

Not sure where to post this?! I spent most of yesterday pm reading the new book in a local GW and noticed these changes.

In Voltaire's compilation thread he has:-

Wight King - no changes - he's been upped to T5

Cairn Wriaths - skirmisher 0-3 - it' 3-10 and may upgrade one to a unit champion (banshee) for the cost of a warbanner. Banshee can stand & shoot and causes Terror!

 

[Mr Saturday]

Cairn Wriaths - skirmisher 0-3 - it' 3-10 and may upgrade one to a unit champion (banshee) for the cost of a warbanner. Banshee can stand & shoot and causes Terror!

You know, I can really see this becoming a significant unit. 3-10, that was unexpected. Pricey, but wow, what a distraction to enemy armies. And I thought the banshee was useful before...

 

[dzungia]

About the Cairn Wraiths, 3 models cause as much terror as 10 models. So, no need to have a large group. However, only banshee can shoot. And 2 wraiths will not be winning CR in Close Combat, not against rank-file units. And if I pay over 200 for a unit, I would at least expect it to win the combat while flanking. But it does not even negate the rank bonuses.
Then, what is this unit for? It seems 5 (6 with the banshee) is reasonable for effectiveness. But this costs over 250. And even if only one wraith dies the effectiveness is lost almost completely.

 

[Mr Saturday]

Well, as for the benefits of this new unit, here's a few:

There is now a shield for the banshee.
A unit of 5 can negate a rank bonus when flanking. (Though admittedly this is an expensive unit.)
Terror, great weapons and a banshee scream attacking an already engaged unit could very easily swing a combat.
Highly mobile, great for catching fleeing units/rear attacks.
A highly visible threat, great for distraction.

All in all, imo, this could be one of the best support units in the game. This is not to say you don't have to be careful, but as they are so mobile, and with the corpse carts helping disrupt enemy magic, it may be that bit easier to keep your floaties going.

 

[kaulem]

A unit of 5 can negate a rank bonus when flanking.

Is this unit 'skirmish'?

because if it is, it can't negate ranks.

I'm not saying it is skirmish, be in my minds eye, that's how I assumed it would be.

 

[N.I.B]

They are skirmishers, of course. It seems mrsaturday need to check up on the basic rules.

It's a fragile unit that is awesome against many armies.

 

[puggimer]

I'm guessing with 2 attacks, GW, and most any enemy unable to hit back, this should be very effective. Especially in a support roll. Add in the scream (especially if it adds to CR).

I may just take 2 units! (the KOBK don't do a lot for me, and won't fit my theme either).

 

[Danceman]

Indeed. Along with a Varghulf this ethereal unit is very likely to be seen in my first army lists. A unit of 5 with banshee is quite costly but fast, hit hard and also invulnerable to mundane attacks. A unit of 5 should have 14 S5 attacks(if rumours be correct). Keep the staff of damnation near and thats another 5 attacks. Watch out for magic missiles though... or really, magic in general.

Pugg: they´ve got 3 attacks from what I´ve heard and the banshee got 2.

 

[NecroNurgle]

Indeed. Along with a Varghulf this ethereal unit is very likely to be seen in my first army lists. A unit of 5 with banshee is quite costly but fast, hit hard and also invulnerable to mundane attacks. A unit of 5 should have 14 S5 attacks(if rumours be correct). Keep the staff of damnation near and thats another 5 attacks. Watch out for magic missiles though... or really, magic in general.

Pugg: they´ve got 3 attacks from what I´ve heard and the banshee got 2.

The banshee has only one and it's a handweapon.

 

[Lord Asuryan]

how much will each cairn wraith cost?

 

[Danceman]

Necronurgle: Ah, thanks for the correction.

Lord Asuryan : Quite sure its the same cost as two war banners. To upgrade one wraith to a banshee you have to pay another war banner.

 

[VladtheLad]

Ah so it might not be so good to uprgade a wraith to a banshee.

You can only upgrade 1 to banshee? I heard you could upgrade up too 3. I could imagine a unit of three banshees pretty much like a hags covenant.

 

[Mr Saturday]

Is this unit 'skirmish'?

because if it is, it can't negate ranks.

They are skirmishers, of course. It seems mrsaturday need to check up on the basic rules.

You are of course, correct. I do apologize. This is indeed a skirmish unit. Even after all these years one forgets a rule from time to time. Even basic ones. Even so, I do believe a great many of us will find a role for this unit in our armies. I am greatly looking forward to trying out some new lists. I hadn't heard that more than 1 wraith could be upgraded to a banshee. That would be wondrous, but I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[dzungia]

It's a fragile unit that is awesome against many armies.

+1

 

[Bug16]

how much will each cairn wraith cost?

Allegedly 45 points a pop.

 

[koon]

What will the Varghulf cost?

Anybody knows if the point values for items and bloodlines posted at warhammerforum is correct?

k.

 

[Bug16]

According to the GW site, the Varghulf is metal! Yes!

 

[koon]

I meant the points value of the Varghulf.

And stats if anybody knows...

k.

 

[Vic]

@ koon: About the Varghulf - what I know is that he'll be around 185 pts (not sure about that though), with Regenerate, Hate, 9mv (not flying) and something like 5 attacks on WS5 and 4 wounds.

What I heard about the Black Coach:

It's basically the same point and stat-wise as the last version, but with 3+ Armor and 4+ Ward save. At the start of every magic phase it takes all generic power dices and all the dices of casters within 6". For every roll of 6 from those dices it gets a special ability.

(in this order 1: Scythed Wheels, 2: Magic Attacks, 3: Killing Blow for all attacks including impact hits, 4: MR 3, 5: Ethereal, 6: Flying.)

 

[koon]

The coach only steals the dice that come up 6, so it might be worth it.

k.

 

[Belladamma Voltaire]

Conjecture places the Varghulf roughly 10 points over the cost of a Bretonnian Trebuchet. It is supposed to have stats similar to that of a Dark Elf Hydra.

 

[Bug16]

Conjecture places the Varghulf roughly 10 points over the cost of a Bretonnian Trebuchet. It is supposed to have stats similar to that of a Dark Elf Hydra.

Doh! I can't remember the last time I even bothered to use my DE Hydra!

 

[N.I.B]

Conjecture places the Varghulf roughly 10 points over the cost of a Bretonnian Trebuchet.

While I'd love that, rumour has it at about 2 Trebuchets I love this guy, he's fast, scary and durable, and gives marching to close units. Very tactical.

 

[Danceman]

Conjecture places the Varghulf roughly 10 points over the cost of a Bretonnian Trebuchet. It is supposed to have stats similar to that of a Dark Elf Hydra.

Doh! I can't remember the last time I even bothered to use my DE Hydra!

Hella different from a hydra. For starters cheaper. Faster. Tougher. Better WS if I remember it correctly. Get re-rolls to hit. So dont dismiss this muscle car vampire just yet.

And concerning the coach or the magical vacuum cleaner. A very different version this time around then or indeed all our rare choices. Cant see any of the new choices as a definite no-brainer choice.

 

[MarkM]

From memory (it was 2 days ago!) Varghulf was 7 Warbanners.