Official Rumour Thread: New Vampire Counts Book

[Duke Danse Macabre]

1) Core is the foundation by its very definition, you need at min of 25% of your force in core and choosing well at this time is paramount otherwise you may just have a 25% speed bump in your army just to meet requirements,your core should always be something solid that can be counted on and GG where they are good just leads to boring games, we are getting new choices now for a reason,so we can experiment.

2) Skip 2 as sorted.

3) We are not really getting amy range but a few models with scream attacks with the banshee rules, Banshee's, Terror Ghiest, Mortis Engine and maybe one or 2 others and if we are lucky it may be a vampire power as well but I doubt it.

 

[N.I.B]

Blood Knights will be 4 points cheaper, but still overcosted thanks to Frenzy. Whether they will be viable at all will be decided by what happens to spammable Vanhels.

 

[Duke Danse Macabre]

4 points is a joke, 45 total would of been fine, I could accept that, slat plate armour on them, increase initiative to 5 and sort out the crumble and you can call them 50 points per but unless there is some serious changes I will not be happy.

 

[Sception]

Oh, I agree that Vamp Counts looking to field a traditional battle line will still need to field the bulk of their points in wights, but the problem with that is that with 25% min core and large expenditures in wights, that only leaves 25% left over for characters and rare, which means very little room indeed for all the new toys we're getting.

It's probably not as bad as I'm making out, though.

 

[Sanai]

Malisteen, no offense, but of course it isnt as bad as your making out. You do tend to portray things in a glass half empty kinda way. (and I do admit that I portray everything glass half full)

 

[HERO]

Blood Knights will be 4 points cheaper, but still overcosted thanks to Frenzy. Whether they will be viable at all will be decided by what happens to spammable Vanhels.

I think it's actually 6 points cheaper. 5 of them in full command is reported to be 250 points, that means 44x5 + 30.

Still, I hope they lose Frenzy and gain +1I and maybe Powerful Charge.

 

[Sanai]

5 Blood Knights with full command for 250 is pretty good for the scariest, hardest hitting heavy cavalry in the game (well, chaos knights are arguably similar in sheer scaryness.)

 

[HERO]

5 Blood Knights with full command for 250 is pretty good for the scariest, hardest hitting heavy cavalry in the game (well, chaos knights are arguably similar in sheer scaryness.)

They're good, but I'm not sure how effective they'll be now with Regen Banner gone or nerfed and Blood Drinker nerfed into the ground.

Maybe the Blood Knight bus will still work, but personally I'm thinking about just doing 2x Terrorgheist + Zombie Lord

 

[Pladvoncarstein]

Has it been confirmed ghouls cannot be raised or healed?

 

[N.I.B]

Blood Knights will be 4 points cheaper, but still overcosted thanks to Frenzy. Whether they will be viable at all will be decided by what happens to spammable Vanhels.

I think it's actually 6 points cheaper. 5 of them in full command is reported to be 250 points, that means 44x5 + 30.

Still, I hope they lose Frenzy and gain +1I and maybe Powerful Charge.

Avian said 4 points cheaper, and he's usually right about everything. We'll see in a few days.
44 points would be 11 points cheaper than today tho. And I do wish they were I5, makes no sense to have Chaos Knight at higher I.

 

[Duke Danse Macabre]

Well with the points still so high and unless they have had stat changes they will be weaker than ever because we can not just add a blood drinker character into the unit so they can carve through things.
Chaos knights still have the clear advantage is all that is changed is points as well.

 

[Count Darvaleth]

Am I the only person who likes Blood Knights having Frenzy, for the simple reason that more attacks = win? Sure you might have to charge sometimes, but at least it's no longer insta-charge like it used to be. Now we have a chance to retrain it. Besides it's kinda fluffy and to be honest, charging with Blood Knights is what I will be doing anyway; I don't care if they hit some throw-away distraction unit, I can be safe in the knowledge that the expendable unit will last precisely zero combat phases against my frenzied knights.

And don't forget we get the same strength as Bretonnian knights using their lances when we use our hand weapons.

 

[Scarr Reincarnated]

Isn't the biggest drawback that they kill something cheap that your opponent sends at them and then they have to overrun into something nasty or something that will become nasty. I once played Dark Elves against a Blood Knight Deathstar. I placed a very expensive corner and a not so expensive corner. He went against the expensive corner were there was a Horde of Spear Warriors, many Characters and some Crossbowmen and also some stuff I don't remember. He charged into the little Crossbowmen unit in front of the Horde of Warriors. He obviously killed them but then he had to overrun into my warriors and I could freely cast Mindrazor on them for the win.

Another example was when my Skaven Furnace unit (also with Frenzy) got charged in the flank by a Chariot. I won the combat due to ranks, banners and some bad rolls on his part, but that was what he wanted. He broke, got away and redirected my unit far from combat.

 

[Duke Danse Macabre]

In 8th edition its not such a bad thing, does not match their lore at all considering they are masters of the art of restraint and would suit an additional attack better but its not really all that bad to have.

When they over run into another unit it will still count as a charge and even better if you can get them into a combat that has yet to be fought so you get another round of attacks.
Magic will always be a wild card, I could cast this, I can cast that, well I decided to use Danse Macabre to flank you then get ASF after lowing your leadership with lore of shadow so I killed allot more guys then you broke and ran and I cut you down.......
If you want to play the what if game magic has an answer for almost anything, you have to see what is the best you can do without it before factoring it in, also dispel is another danger.

 

[Zhatan]

From Warseer:

From a spanish website:

Dark Akolyth: 12.5 skavenslaves
+D3 for Nehek

Quick Blood: 15 skavenslaves
ASF

Curse of Widerganger: 27.5 skavenslaves
+1 W

Red Fury: 25 skavenslaves
same as before, can be used with 2HW

Expert Hit: 7.5 skavenslaves
trade in all attacks for 1 with HKB

Dreadknight: 5 skavenslaves
+2 WS, must issue challenges if no superoir fighter present

Creatures of the night: 5 skavenslaves
increase bats, batswarms & wolves beyond starting size

Forbidden Knowledge: 12.5 skavenslaves
access to rulebook lores (doesn't get to know all spells)

items:
Blade of deathly pain: 37.5 skavenslaves
frenzy, something else, flaming attacks
deathly shriek (similar to banshee?)
If you don't cause a wound in combat, wearer is killed instantly

Leichentuch: 20 skavenslaves
+1 AS, all models in basecontact get no bonuses to their strength & ASL

Banner of the Barrows: 25skavenslaves
Same as

Screaming Banner: 12.5 skavenslaves
Same as

Black Periapt: 27.5 skavenslaves
Stores 2 dice

Staff of Flaming Death: 20 skavenslaves
bound 3+, similar to flame cage

Book of Arkhan: 12.5 skavenslaves
bound 3+, doesn't burn out, same as

Cursed Book: 17.5 skavenslaves
sacrifice D3 power dice to get off a random spell of six (miasma, withering, some others) as a bound with the minimal complexity

Staff of Damnation: ¿?
bound 4+, all models in 6 inches get +1 attack

I have no idea if this is correct or not but if it is I am dissapointed. Leichentuch sounds good but most of it is pretty lackluster imo.

 

[The Dead of Night]

Oh, Forbidden Knowledge and Staff of Damnation both took hits and they were two of my favourites.

Otherwise I think the list is okay. Probably more functional than what some of the other armies have been getting. Nothing extremely powerful, but most are fairly useful.

 

[Pladvoncarstein]

alot more balanced Im liking it. Any idea if those are the only powers this time round?

 

[Duke Danse Macabre]

They are not, I know you are eager for the nerfing to begin as you said prior but that list is missing things we know we already have like banner of blood keep etc so it is incomplete and not in order so odds are this id tid bits from here and there.

 

[Pladvoncarstein]

theres 9 items listed there add the banner of blood keep and thats 10 any more takes us out of line with the other 8th books. I say that if there are anymore items it will only be 1 or 2. But the powers list looks incomplete. Hope they only allow 1-2 powers a vamp though. bring on the nerf

 

[N.I.B]

* I really like that Red Fury gets even better, balanced out by Infinite Hatred seems to be gone.
* ASF returns to Vampiric Power status and thus gets better (combined with high S weapons).
* Leichentuch = Nightshroud? Looks good. For those of you that thinks of combinations were you put your Nightshroud lord on a Coven Throne to get the benefits from the big base - ward saves doesn't normally transfer from mounts to riders, unless specifically stated, meaning your lord doesn't get the 4+ ward save.
* Like the implication from Book of Arkhan that Vanhels stays, unchanged.
* Blade of deathly pain is our new overcosted Frostblade, and falls flat at S5 and popular 5-point Dragonbane Gems. It's Deathly Shriek is rumoured to be like the Terrorgheist one that adds the current number of wounds of the wielder, not that it would differ much from the standard 2D6+2. Oh, and it also gives +1A when charging.

 

[Tim]

I like what I see, good stuff.

 

[HERO]

I like what I see, but under one circumstance: That the powers are bought separate from magic items. If it works like the Big Names, meaning you can only take 1 power per vampire and the cost is shared with your magic items, then I'd say Vampires are F'd.

 

[TMS]

I'm certainly going to miss the cadaverous cuirass, unless we're getting something else to help protect against killing blows. I play against dark elves a lot and they can make sure to have models with killing blow anywhere, at any time. I'd hate to send a fighting vampire lord up against them without some kind of immunity.

 

[Forgotten Heretic]

i'm just pleased forbidden lore has stayed, i'm not really bothered about having to roll for the spells now

 

[Duke Danse Macabre]

9 or 10 is inline?
You have to remember we have gear and blood traits, thats 2 entirely different things, gear itself there is lacking anything to really want at all, nothing with ba wow factor that has been seen in the other books apart from a sword that may kill us..... If thats out gear options they are shameful.
Complete compared to what?.... Something you have never seen?... There is allot missing and unless we are still missing a few items we have already taken a big hit.
At the very least there better be a gear upgrade on character profiles.

I have to ask, are you just on a hunt going from army to army cheering for a nerf or do you have something else apart from cheering for people fears as things get worse the 3rd consecutive time in a row?



I'll miss flayed Hauberk if its gone, only way to really protect vamp heros as it stood with a decent armour save.

So our new sword is a load of rubish.... Great, who am I to complain about the TK equivelent for 5 points more? Can choose to hit every model in base contact, has a +2 strength and Heroic Killing blow slapped with a few extra rules in case he is on a chariot.

As it stand I like the new models but the items and rules I have heard are very disappointing, perhaps VC is to become a display army?.... At least the Zombie Dragon will have company then.